Rioting and Agendas: Who benefits?

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    • #148157
      Joe (G.W.N.S.)
      Moderator

        So we have Rioting all over the U.S.

        The initial violence seems to have gotten a jump start by some white guy in black clothing, paint respirator, and umbrella breaking windows at an AutoZone in Minneapolis. Immediately he leaves.

        Some think possible suspects are Antifa, Alt-Right, and even a LEO.

        I’ve speculated previously that the Antifa/Alt-Right are actually managed by the same people at the highest level.

        Of course the vast majority of Useful Idiots are unaware of this and LEO’s could be mingled in both groups.

        There seems to be actual Protesters and Rioters with some overlap.

        How does this help Socialists?

        How does this help Globalist republicans?

        Is it possible higher level leadership has lost control of their Useful Idiots and this is some organic reaction brought on by impatience?

        Seeing some spread into smaller large cities and suburbs.

        How far could/will it spread?

        Thoughts?

      • #148209
        Sitting Duck
        Participant

          Fifth generation warfare.

          Occupy, Boog, Anarchist Environmentalist, and all the ethno state folks have the same checklist. Get rid of the current situation inorder to implement their own vision.

          Too many people/agendas need the State to fail before their revolution can get started.

          General consensus is much of the current situation is to prevent a Trump reelection. However I agree with your assessment that it’s bigger than that.

        • #148219
          First Sergeant
          Moderator

            I wouldn’t be surprised if there isn’t foreign entities backing some or all of this.

            FILO
            Signal Out, Can You Identify
            Je ne regrette rien
            In Orbe Terrum Non Visi

          • #148290
            Polynikes
            Participant

              I agree with both Sitting Duck and First Sergeant. I’m leaning towards the Chinese (CCP) and/or George Soros. Who benefits from ongoing turmoil and domestic instability? Not our country.

              It’s funny how the Wuhan Virus showed up right when impeachment failed, and now this (as soon as Trump was getting the upper hand with the virus handling and the complete failure by the liberal governors/mayors). I predict more “big events” happening between now and the election.

            • #148415
              gatlinggun
              Participant

                “Ordo Ab Chaos”

                Order from chaos.

                The questions are: Whose order? And how many have to die to bring it about.

                I think the riots have Soro’s name all over them. Although he is probably not alone in not letting this “crisis” go to waste.

                I also think we haven’t seen the last of the “scamdemic”. TPTB will revive it come next flu season.

                They need things to get so bad that people will cry out for government to save them.

              • #148427
                First Sergeant
                Moderator

                  “Ordo Ab Chaos”

                  Order from chaos.

                  The questions are: Whose order? And how many have to die to bring it about.

                  I think the riots have Soro’s name all over them. Although he is probably not alone in not letting this “crisis” go to waste.

                  I also think we haven’t seen the last of the “scamdemic”. TPTB will revive it come next flu season.

                  They need things to get so bad that people will cry out for government to save them.

                  Yes.

                  FILO
                  Signal Out, Can You Identify
                  Je ne regrette rien
                  In Orbe Terrum Non Visi

                • #148430
                  Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                  Moderator

                    I think the riots have Soro’s name all over them. Although he is probably not alone in not letting this “crisis” go to waste.

                    Yes, one of many.

                    This is why the freak out over designating Antifa as terrorist organization.

                    Imagine these people posting bail for Antifa being arrested.

                    Bank accounts frozen, overseas connections hit both overt and covertly.

                    Consider the motives of these so called legal experts that have been preaching why you can’t designate Antifa a terrorist group?

                  • #148434
                    D Close
                    Moderator

                      Assumptions: The Deep State is real. There has been an ongoing soft coup attempt since the Trump election. Trump is a nationalist. Trump is perceived as a real threat to the globalist agenda. Antifa has connections throughout levels of government. The Wuhan virus exposed real economic problems and plunged the US into depression. The Federal Reserve is facing policy failure.

                      The coup continues. This latest assault on American cities is the next chapter. The financial system is in the midst of collapse. Deep State gets another shot at Trump. They are actively trying to create a no-win scenario for him.

                      The riots provide cover for the Fed to bail out states and municipalities. We are looking at a complete collapse of the world monetary structure. Whatever comes after will require a reset of debt and standards of living. The Fed needs cover badly. They broke the economy and it cannot be put back together.

                      Antifa or other radical groups are coordinating and receiving material support. Money is flowing into the BLM groups via corporate payouts, celebrity backing and political cover. This all comes pre-election and serves to energize the base.

                      The corporate media is fully committed against Trump and his followers. They are enjoying huge viewership due to the civil unrest.

                    • #148436
                      Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                      Moderator

                        Yes there are many components involved, though I think I prefer using insurrection to coup. ;-)

                        We need to be able to articulate this in a simple basic manner; avoiding too much doom and gloom tinfoil sounding rhetoric, to those in our sphere of influence.

                        Note: Avoiding too much doom and gloom tinfoil sounding rhetoric, not because it isn’t true, but because it’s too hard to convey quickly and tends to be too much for newer people.

                      • #148444
                        veritas556
                        Participant

                          Yes, keep on prevaricating, pontificating and bloviating (could not find another cool “P” word :) about how to articulate our current sitrep. Patriots indeed. As long as your own 2 square miles of existence is secure, well by God, you have fulfilled your destiny. Our 20 pounds of beans are intact, sir.

                          On one hand, our Covid-patriots have secured the northern border, sanitizer and mask in hand and ready to sneeze into our armpit. Congratulations, comrade – I hope you wore deodorant. Governor So-and-so says you smell swell.

                          On the southern border we have things secured too sir. The natives run wild, pillaging and burning and we stand aside, or perhaps on a knee, to acknowledge our sinful past with due deffrence to the people who deserve this land far more than us. After all, they built it, you see. Though strangely, they cannot till its soil. Madness. And Indians.

                          Finally, there is Joe. Or Dwayne. Or Pete. Or John. Or Steve. Pick a name, means nothing in the end. Maybe carved into granite at some point but… Guys who “trained” for what I don’t know, guys who pressed sandbags day after day to log on a whiteboard, dudes who deadlifted 3 sets a day, burping the word “liberty” in between sets, maybe even squeezed off a few rounds at little squares of paper, who dutifully carried a nine, knife, light and TQ like they did a clean pair of undies every day. These dudes. Squared-the-fuck-away. Passive aggressive as fuck.

                          And then George Washington called from the grave. You heard it… or did you? Maybe that was your buddy saying, “just one more rep”? Yeah, I’m good, bro. Put another plate on… Wanna go shooting this weekend?

                          ***Shouldn’t post this but fuck it. Some people need to hear and see themselves inside of it. Nothing personal but talk and instagram and morale patches are… cheap. If you don’t know who the enemy is, spend more time on that equation, ‘comrade’.***

                        • #148446
                          Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                          Moderator

                            Yes, keep on prevaricating, pontificating and bloviating (could not find another cool “P” word :) about how to articulate our current sitrep

                            Don’t sugarcoat it, tell us what you really think! ;-)

                            You don’t win over people by doom and gloom, that’s how you motivate people temporarily who then go out buy shit they’ll never use or even know how to use.

                            From before Y2K to the latest gun scare, people come and go.

                            Then we have the ones constantly screaming “when are we going to do something!”

                            Yet I can only believe they really mean when am I or anyone but themselves going to do something as I never see any action beyond more screaming from them. :unsure:

                            Hope you feel better after venting, sometimes it’s needed. ;-)

                          • #148447
                            veritas556
                            Participant

                              I’m not venting pal, I’m waiting to be led. In the meantime keep thinking about it all. I’m sure it will make sense. Eventually.

                            • #148448
                              Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                              Moderator

                                I’m waiting to be led.

                                Imagine that!

                              • #148465
                                veritas556
                                Participant

                                  Only a fool acts alone. Oh hell, maybe I’m just waiting to be beamed up to the mothership by our reptilian overlords… that would make more sense than all of this!

                                • #148467
                                  Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                  Moderator

                                    Only a fool acts alone.

                                    Agreed, choose wisely.

                                  • #148473
                                    D Close
                                    Moderator

                                      Yes, keep on prevaricating, pontificating and bloviating (could not find another cool “P” word :) about how to articulate our current sitrep. Patriots indeed. As long as your own 2 square miles of existence is secure, well by God, you have fulfilled your destiny. Our 20 pounds of beans are intact, sir.

                                      ***Shouldn’t post this but fuck it. Some people need to hear and see themselves inside of it. Nothing personal but talk and instagram and morale patches are… cheap. If you don’t know who the enemy is, spend more time on that equation, ‘comrade’.***

                                      Salty and insulting! We all have our ways to handle the stress and it’s better to vent here than with your family. Press on.

                                      To the original question, since this is an intelligence thread and the whole point of the thread was to try and make some sense of the world as it is:

                                      I didn’t like Joe’s ”tin foil” comment to my reply but I get his point. For the information we have from open source it is really difficult for me to answer his serious questions without zooming out.

                                      The insurrection continues. There are certainly spontaneous and uncontrolled elements but the main thrust is supported and directed. As I go above that statement and try to answer the “by whom?” Joe’s tin foil meter may peg out. On the strategic level is where the tin foil jungle awaits.

                                      Operationally, I feel the motivation was to start affecting the suburbia normies. This has some real prizes for the mobs and their directors. For that to be successful they have to establish nearby safe zones that are no-go for the police. I think that has failed thus far.

                                      Unless the mobs can establish control in certain areas with the complicity of certain sympathetic politicians, including police, the insurrection will fade. I perceive they are losing momentum and that will increase frustration for the cadres.

                                      To think about these answers, should we be focused on motive, methods, opportunity? How does the enemy expect or want us to act in response to the events unfolding? What is his next, most likely course of action? What is the enemy desired end state? Where is the main effort? Where can we derail his main effort?

                                    • #148478
                                      Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                      Moderator

                                        I didn’t like Joe’s ”tin foil” comment to my reply but I get his point.

                                        To clarify, there are many things that I list under “tinfoil” that I believe to be true, but can’t prove.

                                        Regarding “tinfoil” topics. Time, place, and audience must be considered.

                                        Historically MVT has steered away from many “tinfoil” topics regardless of whether true or not, because of potential divisive nature of topic and avoiding appearance as a bunch kooks to uninformed.

                                        Also even though we can’t prove it at the moment, it doesn’t take a genius to see coordination behind current events.

                                        There isn’t anything I’ve seen in this thread that is too “tinfoil” beyond what I hope was a tongue and cheek comment regarding “reptilian overlords!” ;-)

                                      • #148483
                                        Civilianresponder
                                        Participant

                                          Guys who “trained” for what I don’t know, guys who pressed sandbags day after day to log on a whiteboard, dudes who deadlifted 3 sets a day, burping the word “liberty” in between sets, maybe even squeezed off a few rounds at little squares of paper, who dutifully carried a nine, knife, light and TQ like they did a clean pair of undies every day. These dudes. Squared-the-fuck-away. Passive aggressive as fuck.***

                                          If you feel the need to do something why don’t you get after it, rather than bitching about what everyone else is doing. We all have a choice about what we need to do, yours is yours and mine is mine. Go find find yourself someone to follow.

                                        • #148488
                                          PaulV
                                          Participant

                                            Veritas and I are good buddies and part of the same tribe. He knew in advance he shouldn’t post, because the response was exactly as anticipated; Butthurt and no unity. Instead of a little introspection and admitting we as a community are all talk no action, it’s “go find someone to follow” because I have my own personal line in the sand. Doesn’t make his points less valid.

                                            Basically we are all just “venting” and quasi chest-pounding with our posts. So when someone calls us out and asks “what are you prepared to do about it?” just blast him and say move on? No wonder we are losing the war.

                                          • #148489
                                            Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                            Moderator

                                              …we as a community are all talk no action…

                                              Based on your timeline or expectations? ;-)

                                              …the ones constantly screaming “when are we going to do something!”

                                              Yet I can only believe they really mean when am I or anyone but themselves going to do something as I never see any action beyond more screaming from them.

                                              Preparation and training are not talk or inaction!

                                              If you truly believe now is the time; perhaps even past time, what are you waiting for? :unsure:

                                              That is a legitimate question.

                                            • #148492
                                              Civilianresponder
                                              Participant

                                                Basically we are all just “venting” and quasi chest-pounding with our posts. So when someone calls us out and asks “what are you prepared to do about it?” just blast him and say move on? No wonder we are losing the war.

                                                “Venting and quasi chest pounding” feel free to carry on with that. I’ll continue doing what I need to be ready. Coming in crying and complaining about what other guys is doing is a great way to build community. The guy asked for someone to lead him, yet you’re blasting me for telling him to find someone to follow :wacko:. If you think something needs to be done then get after it yourself, rather than telling me I need to do something.

                                              • #148494
                                                Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                                Moderator

                                                  …because the response was exactly as anticipated; Butthurt and no unity. Instead of a little introspection…

                                                  I see no “butthurt” expressed, I gave a rational reply.

                                                  I certainly see no attempt at unity by suggesting the training and preparations of others is “all talk no action!”

                                                  Perhaps you could clarify both your and Veritas points?

                                                • #148495
                                                  veritas556
                                                  Participant

                                                    To clarify…. I never said the training and preps of others were “all talk no action”. But since you bring it up, perhaps those things ARE the action. :unsure:

                                                    Coming in crying and complaining about what other guys is doing is a great way to build community.

                                                    I certainly was not doing either of those things – mere commentary on my own observations. By all means, lift and run, young man! If it makes you feel any better, I certainly subject myself to such critiques ;)

                                                    For those getting “ready” I’m curious: for what? You need not answer that here – persec and all – and Lord knows you don’t owe me an explanation, but your ammo fort is asking. Maybe your own subconscious too.

                                                  • #148498
                                                    Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                                    Moderator

                                                      To clarify…. I never said the training and preps of others were “all talk no action”.

                                                      Correct, you didn’t say that, PaulV; a self professed member of your tribe, said that.

                                                      …mere commentary on my own observations.

                                                      In a thread that this discussion has little merit, but it’s my thread so why not see where it goes? ;-)

                                                      …but your ammo fort is asking.

                                                      Whether intentional or not, this suggests that many are over prepared and without a destination in mind for this, but you freely admit your not ready.

                                                      I’m waiting to be led.

                                                      ,

                                                      Since I have no reason to doubt what your saying, this is admitting that both you and your tribe (per PaulV) does not; at this time, have the proper leadership for accomplishing tribe goals.

                                                      Maybe your own subconscious too.

                                                      Perhaps you are projecting your own inadequacies on others?

                                                    • #148499
                                                      PaulV
                                                      Participant

                                                        Don’t know why people have problems admitting faults and shortcomings of their self or group, or feel the need to “win” every conversation? Even when it’s with those on the same “side”. My assumption is 90% of the people here consider themselves to be for one of the liberty-patriot-libertarian-constitutionalist “movements”.

                                                        Joe, I don’t have a timeline or expectations. Do you? As for what am I waiting for? Again, can’t do it alone. And yes, preps, training, PT can be considered action of “getting ready”. But ready for what?

                                                        As a mod on just this site, you know see how much bitching goes on -for years- about the erosion of rights, liberties, government overreach, militarization of LE, 2nd Amendment infringements, Corona Lockdown, forced business closings, taxes etc.

                                                        Again, what are we “getting ready” for? Can’t just be to survive that very unlikely EOTWAWKI “something” all by yourself?

                                                        Certainly neither Veritas nor I am saying “Revolution!” But as a large group of generally like-minded people what are we doing this for? What is your line in the sand? Have you shifted it? If your fellow patriot’s line were crossed 2 states away, would you act or just keep on training and “doing your thing” until your line gets crossed?

                                                        Rhetorical questions that certainly don’t need answered publicly.

                                                        Challenges to think about given lack of central leadership.

                                                        The actions of prepping, PT and training…I think everyone who’s been to MVT does a good amount of those things. But those actions are not changing anything today.

                                                        Damn you Veritas for posting that shit. lol

                                                      • #148501
                                                        PaulV
                                                        Participant

                                                          Rest assured Joe, our tribe is just fine.

                                                          PS Anxiously awaiting your line by line deconstruction of my post. lol

                                                        • #148506
                                                          Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                                          Moderator

                                                            PS Anxiously awaiting your line by line deconstruction of my post. lol

                                                            If you don’t want a discussion, start your own Blog! :yes:

                                                            Particularly when it’s in my Thread! :good:

                                                            Rest assured Joe, our tribe is just fine.

                                                            Just going on what was presented here! Glad all is well. ;-)

                                                          • #148508
                                                            Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                                            Moderator

                                                              Don’t know why people have problems admitting faults and shortcomings of their self or group…

                                                              I believe it’s presumptuous to assume your qualified to point out others faults.

                                                              Traditionally a discussion of collective faults begins with owning one’s own statement of their very own faults.

                                                              This opens the door for such discussion without intentional or unintentional finger pointing.

                                                              or feel the need to “win” every conversation?

                                                              Words have meaning, whether verbal or written. Being held accountable for ones own words shouldn’t be surprising.

                                                              Challenges to think about given lack of central leadership.

                                                              Is there a reason or perceived evidence that people here aren’t considering these?

                                                              I certainly am not in touch with everyone on this forum, but those I am in touch with know the answers and have given much thought to it.

                                                            • #148528
                                                              Thomas
                                                              Participant

                                                                Joe, are we completely off the rails here?

                                                                There is a lot of frustration within the community as the community looks for an event that will free it to act against the tyranny unleashed against it. The line in the sand was probably crossed some time back. Actions in Seattle, Charlotte, and other places provided a test run for what we see now. The problem is that too much of the community wanted to act in a traditional way with a hot situation where armed groups maneuvered against one an another. Unfortunately, in this war, which is well under way, the other side has rendered the approach using guns to battle the enemy obsolete. Guns were, in effect, rendered insignificant for the most part. They went to war without guns using fire and the mob and we have been made to stand by and watch. Their success has been so great that police chiefs, mayors, and citizens are kneeling in subservience. The act of subservience is a culminating event on some level but short of a full victory. In many locations, we have been out maneuvered.

                                                                Local and state leaders must act with backbone and willingness to restore order and they must act soon. The alternative is that the President will be forced to act and will invoke the Insurrection Act. This is not a political or partisan requirement. Order must be restored and lawful control must be reestablished so that the Republic can continue. Without this order, they begin to realize and implement their version of the society.

                                                                What has happened is that these riots have been a successful attack on the society. Particularly damaged have been property rights and the right to move freely within our locales and within the country. Movement was returning in many areas until the riots again limited such movement. Those outside the law maintain the freedom to maneuver. However, if this is to continue, those who have shown fealty will have to allow the lawlessness to move further out from where it began. Physical property can only be destroyed once and the actions taken to show solidarity, to some degree, create an emotional tie to those who are demonstrating and rioting. Protesters and rioters are two sides of the same coin. Day shift and night shift, if you will.

                                                                What must take place is a concerted effort to restore order using recognized authority to enforce the law and reestablish order. Unless this occurs, patriot guns are likely to return to significance. Suburbs are arming up or are already armed up. This represents a change in tactics where rioters and looters come into the suburbs and face resistance. At that point, should it get that far, some type of order will return.

                                                                Who benefits? The radical left that wants a different nation benefits. They implemented a 5GW strategy that saw them gain significant ground physically by controlling police and mayors and emotionally because they did not experience the wood-and-steel afforded the rioters of 1968. These who fund and support the ANTIFA left benefit. Foreign money remains in play to support the insurrection as long as ANTIFA is not named as a terrorist organization. Those who can make immediate hay from the situation benefit. The MSM can spin this any way they choose without counter argument. Politicians who support the left agenda gain significantly because they can, with MSM support, verbally attack their opposition. Any lawless person benefits directly due to prison release and catch-and-release policies in cities. That will continue to benefit as those policies expand.

                                                                Who does not benefit are ordinary law abing citizens. However, their loss could be only in the near term. There are more center and right voters than left voters. If they exercise their power, they can make medium and long term gains in the coming election cycle. While these gains will not prevent that reckoning that is coming, such a victory will create space to better develop a counter to this style of attack, allow moves to more secure locations, and allow further analysis of the left radicals so that effective action can be taken against them.

                                                              • #148530
                                                                Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                                                Moderator

                                                                  Joe, are we completely off the rails here?

                                                                  Certainly some significant thread drift! B-)

                                                                  Consider the following…

                                                                  Several antifa thugs traveled to Yucaipa, California this week to try to stir up some trouble.

                                                                  …remember this is California.

                                                                  There were armed citizens on apartments, houses, and businesses.

                                                                  Socialists have called for investigations into firearms violations by residents. We’ll see if anything comes of that.

                                                                  For the time being I am not concerned about areas not under direct Socialist control. ;-)

                                                                  Some great points Thomas! :good:

                                                                • #148532
                                                                  veritas556
                                                                  Participant

                                                                    Joe, Joe, Joe! Your sense of humor is severely lacking. Please work on that ;) And rather than parse words and phrases, see if you can tackle entire trains of thought and understand the theme/intent/meaning behind the words. Words are mere theatre. But the moral of the story… ah, that’s where the magic lies. But hell, maybe I suck at it so…

                                                                    As for thread drift – the title is “Rioting and agendas: who benefits?”. The meaning and purpose behind my original post, since almost nobody “got it”, was to make light of the fact you’re even asking the question. Pretty sure we all agree on who the “bad guys” are in this play and my mildly mocking commentary was intended to say, “No shit, Sherlock… now what?”. Continuing to discuss the minutiae around Act II in the play is getting tiring (at least to me – and hopefully to others) so let’s get on with discussing Act III. Resolution. mYes, yes, yes it’s “your” thread. But by God, I will have it in my lifetime! Something, something, about not leaving this rot for our children to suffer with, so I’ve heard from so many.

                                                                    Joe, you are one of the good guys I have no doubt. Now you may be a selfish SOB with no regard for anything outside your AO perhaps and that’s your prerogative. Wait…. is THAT it?

                                                                  • #148533
                                                                    Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                                                    Moderator

                                                                      At that point, should it get that far, some type of order will return.

                                                                      It’s difficult to predict the outcome in Socialist controlled cities. Many people will simply abandon them. Destroy enough and they will collapse of their own weight without enough tax revenue to support themselves. Let them defund Police, this will appear up their own destruction.

                                                                      Of course we need to be extremely vocal about no Federal relief for these mismanaged cesspools.

                                                                      Foreign money remains in play to support the insurrection as long as ANTIFA is not named as a terrorist organization.

                                                                      There is much that can be done Globally if we are serious, however the infiltration of Local, State, and Federal Government will greatly complicate matters.

                                                                    • #148538
                                                                      Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                                                      Moderator

                                                                        And rather than parse words and phrases, see if you can tackle entire trains of thought and understand the theme/intent/meaning behind the words.

                                                                        Perhaps if there was a coherent train of thought to follow?

                                                                        Maybe you can dumb it down for me. ;-)

                                                                        But hell, maybe I suck at it so…

                                                                        Hard to argue against this. :-)

                                                                        …now what?”

                                                                        …get on with discussing Act III. Resolution.

                                                                        Sorry, but all I hear are…

                                                                        …the ones constantly screaming “when are we going to do something!”

                                                                        Yet I can only believe they really mean when am I or anyone but themselves going to do something as I never see any action beyond more screaming from them.

                                                                        If you need a step by step plan I don’t believe you can be helped.

                                                                        Perhaps you should put greater emphasis your search for a leader.

                                                                      • #148540
                                                                        Sitting Duck
                                                                        Participant

                                                                          The situation has developed more since my first post.

                                                                          Removing the tinfoil hat, remember the powerful combination of bad luck and incompetence should not be underestimated. While it appears that the riots are a creative form of warfare with deeply sinister goals….. maybe not.

                                                                          The riots may actually “US” firstly by helping to define “US” and “Them” and what “We” want and “They” want. Which even the bickering of this thread demonstrates needs to coalesce.

                                                                          I’m hoping that Politics (Who does what to whom) can be replaced with “rule of law”. the principles of supremacy of the law, equality before the law, accountability to the law, fairness in the application of the law, separation of powers, participation in decision-making, legal certainty, avoidance of arbitrariness, and procedural and legal transparency. Which we haven’t had.

                                                                          Looting is such a dangerous weapon because it can’t be controlled well. The dead shopkeeper might continue to vote Democratic but will the one who got a beat down from someone his liberal governor let out of jail? Especially after being threatened with that jailcell if he opened his business?

                                                                          Guns might, maybe exit this situation with a new respect. Tales of the “first time gun owner” abound. The ‘Trump Slump’ is over.

                                                                        • #148542
                                                                          Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                                                          Moderator

                                                                            Here’s a interesting piece of information, while I haven’t vetted it fully I didn’t want to wait. Perhaps others can look for more examples.

                                                                            The communists in Antifa and Black Lives Matter overtly operating on the ground are supported by and working with the U.S. Muslim Brotherhood, specifically the terrorist group Hamas doing business as CAIR (Council on American Islamic Relations). One only needs to look at the pre-printed signs being carried by throngs of Antifa and Black Lives Matter operatives to find Hamas/CAIR.

                                                                            Will look further into this.

                                                                          • #148544
                                                                            Thomas
                                                                            Participant

                                                                              @Veritas556, I am not sure that we all do agree on who are the bad guys. I am not even sure who all are the actors on the stage. I have seen no evidence that leads me to believe we know the funding sources that pay the foot soldiers.

                                                                              @Sitting Duck, why do you say we have not had equity and fairness under the law? When do you believe the traits you mentioned were lost?


                                                                              @Joe
                                                                              , I agree in socialist locations, hard to predict there. Less so in places such as DFW and Richmond, VA. While the cities are bastion of socialist utopia, the suburbs are not. Gov Northam continued to pour gas on the fire with his decision to remove the statue of GEN Lee from monument row. It would appear that he is attempting to insight conflict.

                                                                            • #148546
                                                                              jwoop66
                                                                              Participant

                                                                                “Passive aggressive as fuck”

                                                                                I don’t think you’re using that term correctly. Passive aggressive is probably the most lethal, aggressive, brutal tactic you can use. The left has changed our society with passive aggressive. We are all here because of passive aggressive. What do you think “systemic racism” is? it is pure passive aggressive. It can be used against you, and if you protest, you are the bad guy. They are just trying to right a wrong. This whole protest is passive aggressive. Its all because of racist aggression. You say, “fine, protest, just don’t burn shit.” They say, “why are you focusing on the few bad actors, a black man was murdered!” The press laps it up. politicians, the ones who are speaking, all feel compelled to tow the line and talk about police injustice and the horrors of systemic racism. Hollywood and music industry is all over it. “We support the protests because George Floyd was murdered by racist cops!” What do you say? “no, that isn’t what happened. Here’s the facts…blah blah, here’s the statistics to back it up, blah blah.” “Racist!!” they say, “Why don’t you care?!”

                                                                                THAT is passive aggressive. It’s punching someone in the face, then opening the door so everyone can see him punch you in return. “look what he did to me!!”

                                                                                Of course no red blooded patriot would use a tactic like passive aggressive, its got the word passive in it. No way. We talk about doing overt, in your face shit. 2nd and 3rd generation shit.

                                                                                The kind of shit that plays right in to their hands.

                                                                              • #148548
                                                                                Sitting Duck
                                                                                Participant

                                                                                  Thomas, I am a farmer. I and almost every farmer I know has had an experience with a trespasser who sticks their badge in the face of the rightful owner.

                                                                                  The entitlement (inequality with the law) is so pervasive that if you complain about a trespassing cop to a member of law enforcement you are likely to get told a story of their own experience and subsequent “dick measuring” contest.

                                                                                  The current lockdown and ticketing of churches and arrest of people who are accused of violation of social distance rules is blatantly anti 1st amendment. Threats to condemn buildings of businesses that have tried to open in violation of governor orders not laws, are clearly excessive. Simultaneously truly Convicted and sentenced prisoners are released, the law is brushed aside.

                                                                                  Firearms laws have been arbitrary and capriciously enforced long before my birth. The connected can post pictures of unallowed NFA items while the subjects face long expensive legal fights for miscounted magazine loadings. The process for a pistol permit is expensive and not likely to be successful. Confiscation for the purpose of “checking on status” is routine at fire scenes. “Shall be infringed” is the defacto state of enforcement.

                                                                                • #148551
                                                                                  Max
                                                                                  Keymaster

                                                                                    Well, that was an interesting thread.

                                                                                    I haven’t been here much. I haven’t run any training for the first 6 months of the year due to COVID. Who isn’t broke?

                                                                                    But anyway. What I have been doing is putting all my energy into developing a mutual support group based around Culpeper. It’s just MVT but locally based. Guys, we are in the collapse, we are in an insurrection to destroy this country.

                                                                                    It is coming. It may even be coming to Culpeper this Saturday, after a peaceful protest on Monday. Fires are being set in the rural areas, literally. Barms and hay fields, houses. Keep an eye on the Intel. Assess the situation. Amd whatever happens in Culpeper on Saturday, massive BLM riot or not, it doesn’t matter, because the insurrection continues. The more they can push this out from the main cities, the more they can injure and kill cops, the more they will overwhelm resources and lead us to WROL. A cop in South Dakota was killed with 47 AK rounds.

                                                                                    We are the little people. No one is going to lead you. I am leading my local group. Lead yourselves. It is these little mutual support groups based around counties that will allow us to survive the storm. You want someone to lead this shit show? There is one guy, he is called Trump. He is in the process of being taken down.

                                                                                    Why be on here? Get training and building your tribes. We only have each other when this shit goes south.

                                                                                  • #148568
                                                                                    Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                                                                    Moderator

                                                                                      …we are in an insurrection to destroy this country.

                                                                                      Exactly and many elements of Local and State Governments are participating in this destruction.

                                                                                      Additionally much of the bureaucracy within both those and Federal Government is an active against us. Some overt, but most are covert.

                                                                                      Keep an eye on the Intel. Assess the situation.

                                                                                      Without reliable local information for analysis you will be at a severe disadvantage and the potential to waste irreplaceable resources is high.

                                                                                      This will be lost or won at the Local level.

                                                                                      Understanding the situation Nationwide has some value, but the primary focus must be within your community.

                                                                                      The IPB you built will be invaluable.

                                                                                      There are many resources here, but practical application is priority.

                                                                                    • #148580
                                                                                      Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                                                                      Moderator

                                                                                        In review!

                                                                                        Occupy, Boog, Anarchist Environmentalist, and all the ethno state folks have the same checklist. Get rid of the current situation inorder to implement their own vision.

                                                                                        Too many people/agendas need the State to fail before their revolution can get started.

                                                                                        General consensus is much of the current situation is to prevent a Trump reelection. However I agree with your assessment that it’s bigger than that.

                                                                                        I wouldn’t be surprised if there isn’t foreign entities backing some or all of this.

                                                                                        I agree with both Sitting Duck and First Sergeant. I’m leaning towards the Chinese (CCP) and/or George Soros. Who benefits from ongoing turmoil and domestic instability? Not our country.

                                                                                        It’s funny how the Wuhan Virus showed up right when impeachment failed, and now this (as soon as Trump was getting the upper hand with the virus handling and the complete failure by the liberal governors/mayors). I predict more “big events” happening between now and the election.

                                                                                        “Ordo Ab Chaos”

                                                                                        Order from chaos.

                                                                                        The questions are: Whose order? And how many have to die to bring it about.

                                                                                        I think the riots have Soro’s name all over them. Although he is probably not alone in not letting this “crisis” go to waste.

                                                                                        I also think we haven’t seen the last of the “scamdemic”. TPTB will revive it come next flu season.

                                                                                        They need things to get so bad that people will cry out for government to save them.

                                                                                        This is why the freak out over designating Antifa as terrorist organization.

                                                                                        Imagine these people posting bail for Antifa being arrested.

                                                                                        Bank accounts frozen, overseas connections hit both overt and covertly.

                                                                                        Consider the motives of these so called legal experts that have been preaching why you can’t designate Antifa a terrorist group?

                                                                                        Assumptions: The Deep State is real. There has been an ongoing soft coup attempt since the Trump election. Trump is a nationalist. Trump is perceived as a real threat to the globalist agenda. Antifa has connections throughout levels of government. The Wuhan virus exposed real economic problems and plunged the US into depression. The Federal Reserve is facing policy failure.

                                                                                        The coup continues. This latest assault on American cities is the next chapter. The financial system is in the midst of collapse. Deep State gets another shot at Trump. They are actively trying to create a no-win scenario for him.

                                                                                        The riots provide cover for the Fed to bail out states and municipalities. We are looking at a complete collapse of the world monetary structure. Whatever comes after will require a reset of debt and standards of living. The Fed needs cover badly. They broke the economy and it cannot be put back together.

                                                                                        Antifa or other radical groups are coordinating and receiving material support. Money is flowing into the BLM groups via corporate payouts, celebrity backing and political cover. This all comes pre-election and serves to energize the base.

                                                                                        The corporate media is fully committed against Trump and his followers. They are enjoying huge viewership due to the civil unrest.

                                                                                        The insurrection continues. There are certainly spontaneous and uncontrolled elements but the main thrust is supported and directed. As I go above that statement and try to answer the “by whom?” Joe’s tin foil meter may peg out. On the strategic level is where the tin foil jungle awaits.

                                                                                        Operationally, I feel the motivation was to start affecting the suburbia normies. This has some real prizes for the mobs and their directors. For that to be successful they have to establish nearby safe zones that are no-go for the police. I think that has failed thus far.

                                                                                        Unless the mobs can establish control in certain areas with the complicity of certain sympathetic politicians, including police, the insurrection will fade. I perceive they are losing momentum and that will increase frustration for the cadres.

                                                                                        To think about these answers, should we be focused on motive, methods, opportunity? How does the enemy expect or want us to act in response to the events unfolding? What is his next, most likely course of action? What is the enemy desired end state? Where is the main effort? Where can we derail his main effort?

                                                                                        There is a lot of frustration within the community as the community looks for an event that will free it to act against the tyranny unleashed against it. The line in the sand was probably crossed some time back. Actions in Seattle, Charlotte, and other places provided a test run for what we see now. The problem is that too much of the community wanted to act in a traditional way with a hot situation where armed groups maneuvered against one an another. Unfortunately, in this war, which is well under way, the other side has rendered the approach using guns to battle the enemy obsolete. Guns were, in effect, rendered insignificant for the most part. They went to war without guns using fire and the mob and we have been made to stand by and watch. Their success has been so great that police chiefs, mayors, and citizens are kneeling in subservience. The act of subservience is a culminating event on some level but short of a full victory. In many locations, we have been out maneuvered.

                                                                                        Local and state leaders must act with backbone and willingness to restore order and they must act soon. The alternative is that the President will be forced to act and will invoke the Insurrection Act. This is not a political or partisan requirement. Order must be restored and lawful control must be reestablished so that the Republic can continue. Without this order, they begin to realize and implement their version of the society.

                                                                                        What has happened is that these riots have been a successful attack on the society. Particularly damaged have been property rights and the right to move freely within our locales and within the country. Movement was returning in many areas until the riots again limited such movement. Those outside the law maintain the freedom to maneuver. However, if this is to continue, those who have shown fealty will have to allow the lawlessness to move further out from where it began. Physical property can only be destroyed once and the actions taken to show solidarity, to some degree, create an emotional tie to those who are demonstrating and rioting. Protesters and rioters are two sides of the same coin. Day shift and night shift, if you will.

                                                                                        What must take place is a concerted effort to restore order using recognized authority to enforce the law and reestablish order. Unless this occurs, patriot guns are likely to return to significance. Suburbs are arming up or are already armed up. This represents a change in tactics where rioters and looters come into the suburbs and face resistance. At that point, should it get that far, some type of order will return.

                                                                                        Who benefits? The radical left that wants a different nation benefits. They implemented a 5GW strategy that saw them gain significant ground physically by controlling police and mayors and emotionally because they did not experience the wood-and-steel afforded the rioters of 1968. These who fund and support the ANTIFA left benefit. Foreign money remains in play to support the insurrection as long as ANTIFA is not named as a terrorist organization. Those who can make immediate hay from the situation benefit. The MSM can spin this any way they choose without counter argument. Politicians who support the left agenda gain significantly because they can, with MSM support, verbally attack their opposition. Any lawless person benefits directly due to prison release and catch-and-release policies in cities. That will continue to benefit as those policies expand.

                                                                                        Who does not benefit are ordinary law abing citizens. However, their loss could be only in the near term. There are more center and right voters than left voters. If they exercise their power, they can make medium and long term gains in the coming election cycle. While these gains will not prevent that reckoning that is coming, such a victory will create space to better develop a counter to this style of attack, allow moves to more secure locations, and allow further analysis of the left radicals so that effective action can be taken against them.

                                                                                        Here’s a interesting piece of information, while I haven’t vetted it fully I didn’t want to wait. Perhaps others can look for more examples.

                                                                                        The communists in Antifa and Black Lives Matter overtly operating on the ground are supported by and working with the U.S. Muslim Brotherhood, specifically the terrorist group Hamas doing business as CAIR (Council on American Islamic Relations). One only needs to look at the pre-printed signs being carried by throngs of Antifa and Black Lives Matter operatives to find Hamas/CAIR.

                                                                                        Will look further into this.

                                                                                        What I have been doing is putting all my energy into developing a mutual support group based around Culpeper. It’s just MVT but locally based. Guys, we are in the collapse, we are in an insurrection to destroy this country.

                                                                                        It is coming. It may even be coming to Culpeper this Saturday, after a peaceful protest on Monday. Fires are being set in the rural areas, literally. Barms and hay fields, houses. Keep an eye on the Intel. Assess the situation. Amd whatever happens in Culpeper on Saturday, massive BLM riot or not, it doesn’t matter, because the insurrection continues. The more they can push this out from the main cities, the more they can injure and kill cops, the more they will overwhelm resources and lead us to WROL. A cop in South Dakota was killed with 47 AK rounds.

                                                                                        We are the little people. No one is going to lead you. I am leading my local group. Lead yourselves. It is these little mutual support groups based around counties that will allow us to survive the storm. You want someone to lead this shit show? There is one guy, he is called Trump. He is in the process of being taken down.

                                                                                        Why be on here? Get training and building your tribes. We only have each other when this shit goes south.

                                                                                        …we are in an insurrection to destroy this country.

                                                                                        Exactly and many elements of Local and State Governments are participating in this destruction.

                                                                                        Additionally much of the bureaucracy within both those and Federal Government is an active against us. Some overt, but most are covert.

                                                                                        Keep an eye on the Intel. Assess the situation.

                                                                                        Without reliable local information for analysis you will be at a severe disadvantage and the potential to waste irreplaceable resources is high.

                                                                                        This will be lost or won at the Local level.

                                                                                        Understanding the situation Nationwide has some value, but the primary focus must be within your community.

                                                                                        The IPB you built will be invaluable.

                                                                                        There are many resources here, but practical application is priority.

                                                                                      • #148604
                                                                                        Polynikes
                                                                                        Participant

                                                                                          Guys,
                                                                                          While I’m not an old geezer just yet, I’m old enough to remember all EOTWAWKI scenarios since Y2K, and I agree with Joe that they came and went (along with their doomsday prophets, who would simply move onto the next event/date ominously coming up on the horizon). I had friends get too deeply and emotionally invested in the prepping mindset, and ended up divorced, unemployed, depressed (and even worse). I’ve come to realize and live by the following principles:
                                                                                          – Life will go on, regardless of how prepped, pumped up, locked and loaded, or depressed we are. No matter how upset or heated we get about the macro reality around us (politically, economically, socially, etc.), we cannot change it individually. What we can control is our own attitudes and our immediate circles of influence (family, neighbors, friends, tribes).
                                                                                          – I am at peace with whatever happens. If everything falls apart tomorrow evening while I’m standing guard (armed) outside of a friend’s business during a planned protest, so be it. If not, I will take my wife and kids to an amusement park or to a beach later this month. And yes, I will be back working my corporate job on Monday morning.
                                                                                          – I will continue to train, keep in shape, and prep as I’ve always done. I hope it never comes to a point where they become vital or necessary to my survival, but if they do, I’m at peace with it.
                                                                                          – I will keep a cool head regardless of how crazy things get around me.

                                                                                          We are all like-minded, and typically Alpha-type personalities here, and I love that. It’s easy (and tempting) to see who’s more hard-core, more bad-ass, tougher, fitter, a better shooter, etc. – and that’s not necessarily a bad thing. I just want to remind everyone not to lose sight of the bigger picture and not let the “vortex” of craziness around us suck us in.

                                                                                        • #148605
                                                                                          Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                                                                          Moderator

                                                                                            Excellent point of view Polynikes! :good:

                                                                                            If not, I will take my wife and kids to an amusement park or to a beach later this month.

                                                                                            Quoted for emphasis.

                                                                                            I prepare to live, I don’t live to prepare!

                                                                                          • #148607
                                                                                            Civilianresponder
                                                                                            Participant

                                                                                              :good:

                                                                                            • #148609
                                                                                              gatlinggun
                                                                                              Participant

                                                                                                …we are in an insurrection to destroy this country.

                                                                                                Exactly and many elements of Local and State Governments are participating in this destruction.

                                                                                                Now certain cities are saying they are going to either defund or reduce the funding to the police. LA mayor said they would cut 100-150 million from the police budget.

                                                                                                We are currently in the “chaos” phase of Ordo ab Chaos. The chaos will get worse until people beg for it to stop at any cost.

                                                                                                • This reply was modified 2 months, 1 week ago by gatlinggun.
                                                                                                • This reply was modified 2 months, 1 week ago by gatlinggun.
                                                                                              • #148612
                                                                                                Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                                                                                Moderator

                                                                                                  We are currently in the “chaos” phase of Ordo ab Chaos. The chaos will get worse until people beg for it to stop at any cost.

                                                                                                  I understand the theory and those of you in Socialist controlled and leaning areas are really going to face challenges (putting it mildly).

                                                                                                  I am still somewhat optimistic for certain Regions and States.

                                                                                                  However this is a unprecedented situation so we’ll have to see what actually happens.

                                                                                                  Despite his failings, President Trump is a significant barrier to Socialist agenda.

                                                                                                  Interesting times! :yes:

                                                                                                • #148615
                                                                                                  Short Stroke
                                                                                                  Participant

                                                                                                    Right on, Polynikes. If you’re not having a good time—no matter the circumstances—then you’re doing it wrong.

                                                                                                  • #148618
                                                                                                    veritas556
                                                                                                    Participant

                                                                                                      So first I’d like to apologize for derailing Joe’s thread. It was in fact my intent. Why? Because I personally think the continued treading over the same ground (who are these dastardly socialists?, what happened to our liberty?, what will become of us?, etc) ad nauseam is pointless and counterproductive. Rome burns, yet we seem to be collectively content to chat about anything but putting that fire out… as long as it’s not burning our own house.

                                                                                                      Yes, there is incredible potential energy in training, prepping, organizing and the like. These are valuable personal and (potentially) community assets – provided they are unleashed into kinetic energy at some point. Otherwise, mere hobbies and a lower BMI. My light-hearted mocking of “hobby patriots” is bar-room ball busting… but with a kernel of truth. Nothing personal. Not even to Joe ;)

                                                                                                      I thought rightful liberty and the principles that underlie it were valued beyond ones own driveway. But it is becoming obvious that some only care about their own cul de sac. It’s your right, but a shame nonetheless if you profess to believe in such things. The Left gets it. For them, right or wrongly, an injustice in Minneapolis is an injustice in Columbus, or New York, or Philadelphia.

                                                                                                      But I’m beginning to think @Max is right…

                                                                                                      We are the little people. No one is going to lead you. I am leading my local group. Lead yourselves.

                                                                                                      The world is short on leadership, none more so than amongst the liberty movement. Colonel Fatso notwithstanding. But perhaps there are lessons to be learned from Afghanistan where local tribes held off the mighty (yet politically hamstrung) U.S. military for 20 years. Then again there are significant dissimilarities which might make such lesson inapplicable to ourselves?

                                                                                                      And @jwoop66 – you are right. What I really meant but chose the words poorly was “aggressive-passive”, not passive-aggressive. Though which is worse for a patriot to be?

                                                                                                      I’m not here to fight or argue with anyone. The people on this board (even Joe… I think) are the good guys in the scheme of things. But since I can’t event fart on social media without a shitstorm raining down on me and my business concerns, this board has been a place to vent and ask, “what the fuck, guys?”. Perhaps the unity in purpose and action I seek is simply too idealistic for today’s reality. Though I have shelves of books reminding me that it’s been done before on this very soil.

                                                                                                      I think I have finally, and at long last, ‘read the room’. And most importantly, written something that Joe actually understands.

                                                                                                    • #148620
                                                                                                      Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                                                                                      Moderator

                                                                                                        Perhaps the unity in purpose and action I seek is simply too idealistic for today’s reality.

                                                                                                        If you desire unity in purpose and action “putting that fire out” then seek it outside the virtual world of a internet forum!

                                                                                                        Your feeble attempts at elicitation is either born of ignorance or worse.

                                                                                                        Regardless your involvement in this thread is over.

                                                                                                      • #148652
                                                                                                        Andrew
                                                                                                        Participant
                                                                                                        • #148653
                                                                                                          Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                                                                                          Moderator

                                                                                                            Excellent contribution Andrew! :good:

                                                                                                          • #148656
                                                                                                            Andrew
                                                                                                            Participant

                                                                                                              This goes hand in hand with my prior poat. Thank you for the attaboy Joe.

                                                                                                              https://www.citizenreviewonline.org/2010/Jun/communism.html

                                                                                                              They have been at this for a long, long time.

                                                                                                            • #148657
                                                                                                              Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                                                                                              Moderator

                                                                                                                From above link…

                                                                                                                38. Transfer some of the powers of arrest from the police to social agencies. Treat all behavioral problems as psychiatric disorders which no one but psychiatrists can understand [or treat].

                                                                                                                Seems particularly relevant to some recent Police disbanding talk.

                                                                                                              • #148658
                                                                                                                Andrew
                                                                                                                Participant

                                                                                                                  15, 16, 17, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 30, 32, 36, and 39, are all pretty much done deals.

                                                                                                                  These are some of the reasons I say that Democrat/Progressive/Liberal/Socialist are all synonyms for Communism.

                                                                                                                • #148659
                                                                                                                  Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                                                                                                  Moderator

                                                                                                                    These are some of the reasons I say that Democrat/Progressive/Liberal/Socialist are all synonyms for Communism.

                                                                                                                    Yep, I’ve used the term Socialist to avoid early overuse, but obviously pretty much the same thing.

                                                                                                                    Makes me want to dig out my 80’s “I’d rather be Killing Communists!” T-Shirt. ;-)

                                                                                                                  • #148663
                                                                                                                    Lloyd
                                                                                                                    Participant

                                                                                                                      Makes me want to dig out my 80’s “I’d rather be Killing Communists!” T-Shirt. ;-)

                                                                                                                      :good:

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                                                                                                                    • #148854
                                                                                                                      Andrew
                                                                                                                      Participant

                                                                                                                        Video of my June 6 post for the reading challenged folks. Or the Reader’s Digest version.

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