Water Sources SW AZ (Moved: Reply To: Civilian-Centric Tactical Questions)

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Home Forums Self-Reliance & Preparedness Water Sources SW AZ (Moved: Reply To: Civilian-Centric Tactical Questions)

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    • #90944
      Abacus
      Participant

        I think this question goes here, of not please advise me where it goes.

        I recently moved to SW AZ from NW FL as part of the military nomad life. My biggest concern out here is water. I carry a mostly full 3L bladder in my EDC pack along with a Nalgene or similar sized container. For trips outside town this gets aurmented with addition bottles. I also have a life straw and am looking to upgrade to an inline filter. We have bottled water in the house, aty office, and in each of our the cars.

        Besides stockpiling water preevemt and having a way to clean water should the municipal supply (or similar) be available but not potable, what am I missing? Were I a pemenent resident I would look into a well, but I am a renter.

        I don’t honestly think the city has enough water organically to support the population without bringing in outside resources. Our river is not really a river. But, I might be wrong.

      • #90945
        Joe (G.W.N.S.)
        Moderator

          First the easier part.

          …am looking to upgrade to an inline filter.

          Check out this review Sawyer Mini Water Filtration System. Best bang for the buck in water filtration and some models work for inline use.

          Depending on household size storage is about the best you can do.

          Using Yuma as an example with 3.09″ average yearly rainfall. This limits many options.

          As part of your IPB identify sources of usable water.

          Who lived there a hundred years ago?

          How did they source water?

          Water is there, just have to learn where. Of course that doesn’t mean there is enough to support current population in a larger scale event.

        • #90946
          wheelsee
          Participant

            I use a Sawyer on my Camelbak (CB), about 4” upstream of the mouthpiece. This allows me to filter city water, and anything else.

            I used to think that only clean water should go into the CB but that meant carrying something to filter into. This allows me to remove the CB from the pack and rapidly fill the bladder, if needed. It does prevent the supply tube from routing through the small holes.

          • #90947
            Abacus
            Participant

              I have been doing some IPB already there is plenty of water in the mountains and some of the canyons north of town. I am in the valley and it is bone dry a lot of the year. I need to figure out where the nearest canal is. They are all over Yuma but I have yet to see any in my neck of the desert yet. Problem is 100 years ago there was water in the river. According to the local angry environmentalists the cutting of irrigation canals back in the day changed all that.

              There is ground water out here, it is just tough to get at. They put the DoD aircraft boneyard out here because it is really dry and the soil is basically a tarmac. I might try the solar still in the wash behind my house.

            • #90948
              Abacus
              Participant

                I would like to be able to handle viruses. But I don’t know if I actually “need” that capability. Sawyers don’t do that but some of the more spendy filters do.

                Does anyone have any experience with the rapid pure scout line of filters? They look a lot like fancy Sawyers with the ability to handle viruses. They work a little different and don’t appear to just stop when they are past their useful life like the Sawyer and similar micro filters meaning in theory I could pull dirty water through them and not get any filter action after is is used up.

              • #90949
                Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                Moderator

                  They look a lot like fancy Sawyers with the ability to handle viruses.

                  From Sawyer:

                  The PointZERO TWO Purifier™ has a 0.02 micron absolute pore size and therefore will remove all viruses like Hepatitis A in addition to bacteria and protozoa.

                  …don’t appear to just stop when they are past their useful life like the Sawyer and similar micro filters meaning in theory I could pull dirty water through them and not get any filter action after is is used up.

                  The Sawyer can and should be backwashed to extend its life. I’ve never used one up. Keep it from freezing and it should last virtually forever, or course as reasonable as the standard filter is I would keep stocked up.

                  Do I really need a way to nail viruses?

                  For the most part no.

                  From Sawyer:

                  Do I need the pointONE Filter™ or the PointZERO TWO Purifier™?

                  To play it safe you can always take the pointZERO TWO purifier, but people in their natural environments typically only need bacterial protection because they build up immunity overtime to the viruses they have been exposed to.

                  The possible advantages for the PointZERO Two would be travel to infectious areas or unforeseen outbreak here. It wouldn’t hurt to have one put away just in case, however I don’t consider it a high priority for me.

                • #90950
                  Corvette
                  Participant

                    Plus, you can get the Sawyer Mini at Wally World for $20.

                  • #90951
                    Abacus
                    Participant

                      On the filter front, I will be acquiring one of swayers 3 in 1 kits and a food safe bucket. This setup should meet my home emergency filtration needs for the time being. I will also work for glamping For my hydro carrier a mini will work just fine when paired with the right tubing and adapters. I can always throw a virus filter “down stream” of the Sawyers if I need to and have a two stage system.

                      As for the IPB, I have not found any of the irigation canals yet. But there is a swimming pool shaped cistern in my neighbors yard. There are actually a lot of them in the neighborhood. I am not sure how I missed it before.

                      The golf course by my office also has a really nasty looking pond that I would need to be awfully thirsty to pull from.

                    • #90952
                      Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                      Moderator

                        In my area you can get the health department to test water samples for not too much. Might be worth a Sawyer mini used for the worst sample to see results, might be better than you think.

                        There may be some studies available detailing possible threats that can’t be filtered that would be worth knowing.

                      • #90953
                        wheelsee
                        Participant

                          Warning – to my knowledge, NONE of the personal filters wil filter out pesticides (you mentioned irrigation canals and golf course), also fertilizers…..think organophosphate poisoning (pesticide – think malathion and its family)

                        • #90954
                          Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                          Moderator

                            …think organophosphate poisoning

                            …get the health department to test water samples for not too much.

                            One of the reasons why this maybe necessary.

                            In Florida we have Water Management districts that can provide most of this type of information, but I am not sure how that translates to other States.

                          • #90955

                            Both Seychelle and Birkey claim to filter bacteria, viruses and most chemicals. Seychelle also has a a radioactive particles filter. Potable Aqua has a solar powered chlorine generator for water treatment.

                          • #90956
                            Abacus
                            Participant

                              Warning – to my knowledge, NONE of the personal filters wil filter out pesticides (you mentioned irrigation canals and golf course), also fertilizers…..think organophosphate poisoning (pesticide – think malathion and its family)

                              That is why both of those were in the C and E section of a water PACE plan.But it bears further study.i wonder if steam distillation would do the trick?

                            • #90957
                              Abacus
                              Participant

                                Based on some further research organophosphates, heavy metals, and the like are only really removed by reverse osmosis or long contact time with activated granular charcoal (like what is in a gas mask filter).

                                An inline filter is probably not going to make the water sources I mentioned safe if they have pesticides in them.

                                A water vapor still might get some of the bad stuff, but I don’t know for sure and have to do more research into the chemistry of the stuff used in industrial farming out here.

                                Theoretically, you could split the water into pure hydrogen and oxygen using electrolysis. Then you could burn the hydrogen and capture the water vapor. I did the first part in a class I guest taught. But electrolysis takes a lot of energy.

                              • #90958

                                My water supply is a well in an industrial ag area and I use a Berkey water filter. Are the test lab results put out by Berkey untrustworthy? Should I be using something else?

                              • #90959
                                wheelsee
                                Participant

                                  My water supply is a well in an industrial ag area and I use a Berkey water filter. Are the test lab results put out by Berkey untrustworthy? Should I be using something else?

                                  A simple answer can be found by sending your pre-filtered water and post-filtered water for testing. Many water departments will do, others include public health departments, private companies, etc.

                                • #90960
                                  farmer
                                  Participant

                                    The Home Depot in my area does free water tests. Maybe in your area also. Or check the local university.

                                  • #90961
                                    Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                    Moderator

                                      A simple answer can be found by sending your pre-filtered water and post-filtered water for testing.

                                      Trust, but verify!

                                      When your dealing with a particularly hazardous environment I recommend this.

                                    • #90962

                                      Thanks

                                    • #90963
                                      HitsCount
                                      Participant

                                        I am also residing in the SW for awhile.

                                        Long term “bug in” in the SW isn’t viable for the SW metro areas without municipal water. All the lifestraws in the world won’t solve the problem in Phoenix, Kingman, Vegas, etc. So I think the realistic mindset is to have enough water on hand to wait out initial disruptions in service until either (A) service can be restored or (B) it is realistic to consider convoying out to somewhere with resources needed to support human life.

                                        For our solution, we have 3×55 gallon drums in the backyard. I got a rattle can of khaki flat paint and painted them and they blend in fairly well against the brick walls surrounding the place. We also have the water BOBs for the tubs but that requires a heads up to fill them. Lots of smaller water jugs obviously.

                                        Each drum provides enough to:
                                        1) Get water for four adults for a week (at double the minimum intake rate) or
                                        2) Run the swamp cooler for most of the heat of the day for a week. Our swamp cooler can run off battery/solar with gen backup.

                                        So that gives us two weeks of drinking water and one week of swamp cooler, plus anything in the small jugs and BOBs.

                                        Looking at recent history, most emergencies will be largely resolved from a “life sustaining needs” point of view within two weeks. A few 55 gallon drums will buy you this much time and allow you and your family to hunker down. Assuming a local or regional event, your AMEX Platinum (if you’re .mil you should have one!) can get you a nice hotel room outside the affected area. If there is complete civilizational collapse a few drums gives you a few weeks to hunker down, let the worst of the dust initially settle, then convoy out to somewhere with realistic resources.

                                        One of the 275 gallon carriers would be even better if you can stash it in your yard or garage.

                                        Unless you have a semi-isolated property with deep cisterns, a well (that can run off solar/wind), stream access, and/or rain collection (which is legally restricted in the SW other than your roof for the most part) then the SW is not really realistic to live in without modern infastructure

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