Chiropractic treatment?

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    • #91876
      Joe (G.W.N.S.)
      Moderator

        Want some thoughts regarding chiropractic treatment.

        I’ve never been to a chiropractor and rarely go to a any doctor since retirement. Had a lifetimes worth of that when recovering at Walter Reed and Bethesda.

        Beyond aspirin and vitamin “M” no more daily drugs for me.

        Anyway a friend has a son who is offering to do some pro bono work because of all the help I have done for his parents over the years. Just being a good neighbor from my point of view.

        The last few years the various injuries sustained in my career have been haunting me. Despite being in good shape and continued PT, until I warm up and get going have a pronounced limp. It does go away after I get moving.

        Its been so noticeable that they talked to their son and he offered to see what he can do.

        Some of this supposedly can be treated surgically, but I am not going that route.

        Appreciate any thoughts and and experiences.

      • #91877
        RobM
        Participant

          Well i know that some call chiropractors witch doctors but I have disagree. However, much like anything else, it depends on who you go to. Personally, I struggled with lower back pain for almost 8 years, caused by a dirt bike accident. It was so bad that I couldn’t walk at times. Mind you, this dirt bike accident occurred when I was 18. So my early to mid twenties were tough. One day at work I had mentioned that my back was bothering me and one of my colleagues recommended that I go to his chiropractor (he swore by him)…reluctantly I did. Sure enough 3 sessions later I didn’t have lower back pain anymore. 31 years old now and in better shape than I have been my entire life. I couldn’t believe the outcome in only 3 sessions.

          Now, I do believe that the more you go the more things “slip”. There was a period that I was going weekly (company paid for it) and I found that I’d have more ribs out of place or kinks in the neck. I maybe go twice a year now for alignments. But in my experience, it worked for me. Sounds cliche, but changed my life from the daily pain that I wrestled with. I wrestle and box weekly and have never had the lower back pain repeat itself. So I’d say go, try it out.

        • #91878
          SeanT
          Keymaster

            I have had some luck in 2 instances:
            First was a fall injury where I tore ligaments along spine. After healing( 9-10 months) I had a constant ‘tightness’ in the area. This lasted a couple years then on a whim, went to a practitioner and got one big adjustment and 100% fixed.

            second is more related to my posture from being a desk jockey for years and sitting at a computer for way too many hours a day. It helped release some of the tensions so that I could stretch more effectively. I had my feet and toes adjusted and that reduced some nerve pain I had in my big toe.

          • #91879
            Joe (G.W.N.S.)
            Moderator

              Appreciate the feedback RobM and SeanT. :good:

            • #91880
              idahocajun
              Participant

                I’ll give my two cents for what it’s worth. Chiropractors can be compared to any other job, there are great ones and then there are some that will mess you up. You can apply that to pretty much any field: MD, mechanic, etc. As an ER doc, I’ve seen some pretty serious complications from manipulation. But on the other and, I’ve seen perforated bowels from colonoscopies too. My point, research the person you’re interested in going to. Look at their training background (usually on their website). Make sure their licenses are in order (state dependent, here in Idaho message therapists are governed by the medical board?!?!). Also, try and get some personal recommendations. All that being said, when it comes to physical health, can’t be too cautious. My thoughts, for what they’re worth.

              • #91881
                Pinky
                Participant

                  i love my chiropractor; met him while playing rugby. Once you find a good one, you’ll never leave him/her. If I don’t go every 6 weeks or so, I can hardly walk or sleep. If I go every 4 weeks like he tells me (maintenance mode), I am GTG. I have level 4/5 degeneration in my L4/L5 (or something like that – right where back meets pelvis). If I don’t get adjusted, pinched nerve, sciatica (sp?), shooting pain down my right leg, numbness, etc.

                  go until you find a good one; you’ll know! good luck

                • #91882
                  Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                  Moderator

                    I’ll give my two cents for what it’s worth.

                    Appreciate it.

                    With all the Docs I’ve dealt with you get a decent feel for them.

                    From my perspective there are some truly gifted, some decent, and a whole lot of varying degrees of terrible.

                    As you said, the same could be said about most professions.

                    As a whole the medical field is great at putting things back together and just ok with some neurological troubleshooting.

                    My biggest complaint is so many pushing pills.

                    There was a time I was on a ridiculous number of pills and injectable meds, a quarter of them were to battle the side effects of the others. Finally enough was enough and I got off them and health improved considerably. Admittedly some were necessary for a time, but would still be on most if I hadn’t put my foot down and said no!

                    With my medical history I expect some complications.

                    Some truly exceptional Docs did their best and I am greatful, but I’ve reached the limits of what they currently can do without a chance of making things worse. Risk outweighs the rewards IMHO.

                    So I am considering this guy’s offer, he’s been at it for a long time, and has a impressively equipped facility.

                    I admit some reluctance, hence the posted thread here.

                    I know even with the current discomfort, not doing PT doesn’t help, in fact things get worse.

                    good luck

                    Thanks for the input.

                  • #91883
                    Daniel
                    Participant

                      Mine keeps me going. I went to a “manipulation” type for years but it got to where it hurt too much having her jump up and down on me while I was already in pain – rather like being in a car accident. Switched to an old dude who does the “clicker” thing and I get the goodness without the badness. I have some scoliosis in the very low back and things like deadlifts can compress it and make the muscles angry. Nothing helps until I get a session or three, depending on how bad it is and how long I’ve let it go, then good for another few months.

                    • #91884
                      Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                      Moderator

                        Thanks Daniel.

                      • #91885
                        Daniel
                        Participant

                          You bet. Palmer in Iowa is one of the main farms pushing out manipulator type chiros and Logan outside of St Louis is the premier farm for Activator (clicker) practitioners. This link will tell you more and point you to a nearby doc.

                          http://www.activator.com/

                        • #91886
                          Max
                          Keymaster

                            I have always hated the neck adjustment thibg chiropractors do. Never let them! If he is still on here, Eric from CA is a chiro.

                            There is a different path / tradition in the UK of physiotherapists. You can sometime find a qualified massage therapist who can achieve the same tissue massge effects. We had a great chiro in CA who I went to for sift tissue injuries and he was knowlegeable in that sports injiry field. So in my mind it is finding soneone who is closest to a physio. Never found a ‘physical therapist’ who was worth shit. But if you can find someone who is skilled at ‘sports medicine’ you are on the right track, and some chiros do that. So what I am saying is that I am less interested in the ‘bone clicking’ and more in tissue therapy.

                            For example, Eric gave me some great advice in Texas last year about what I can and cannot do recovering from my spinal fusion. That guy knows his stuff, and that may be sonething to to do with him being a martial artist / sports guy.

                            I also rated physios on how much tissue massage they did. Sone would just throw on ultra-sound. The good ones would provide some happy pain with a deep tissue massage of the injury etc.

                          • #91887
                            Max
                            Keymaster

                              Is it just me but is the link in the post above mine overlaying mine? Software malfunction?

                            • #91888
                              Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                              Moderator

                                Is it just me but is the link in the post above mine overlaying mine? Software malfunction?

                                Not just you and I am not sure why, but I fixed it.

                                …neck adjustment thibg chiropractors do.

                                Don’t think I can let anyone do that either. ;-)

                                Thanks Max, got a lot to think about.

                              • #91889
                                wheelsee
                                Participant

                                  Always remember –
                                  1) the difference between a “good pop” and a “bad pop” is a hair’s breadth (especially in the spine), bad pops ain’t good…..
                                  2) the body heals at a fairly fixed rate, take the time to let it heal (stimulators may help but generally only in those who are “slow healers”),
                                  3) pain is the body’s way of saying STOP!!, discomfort/soreness is the body’s way of saying “hmm, haven’t done that in awhile” (failure to adhere to this usually results in a trip to the ED or ortho)
                                  4) what can take a split second to damage can take weeks/months/years to heal (if ever)
                                  5) the “original” equipment is usually better than the repair/reconstruction
                                  6) in the end, it’s your body, if something doesn’t seem/sound right, it probably isn’t.

                                  Just observations from one in the medical field for 35 years…….

                                  edit – there is a difference between acute pain and chronic pain. #3 is specific to acute pain.

                                • #91890
                                  Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                  Moderator

                                    3) pain is the body’s way of saying STOP!!, discomfort/soreness is the body’s way of saying “hmm, haven’t done that in awhile” (failure to adhere to this usually results in a trip to the ED or ortho)

                                    I agree completely, but (there’s always a but ;-) ) for me once I warm up and stretch I don’t have pain. Longer I sit the longer it takes to get going and more pain.

                                    The damage in my c-spine is controlled as long as I keep supporting muscles strong. I also have to be aware of how I exercise. For example when I do pull ups. I can’t continue til exhaustion or the supporting muscles don’t support enough and I am screwed up for many days. I have to know just how far I can go.

                                    Then to really throw a wrench into the mix, some of my “pain” is phantom related to nerve damage. Makes troubleshooting difficult.

                                    4) what can take a split second to damage can take weeks/months/years to heal (if ever)

                                    This is why I am so cautious about how I exercise and slow to adapt untried (by me) methods.

                                    6) in the end, it’s your body, if something doesn’t seem/sound right, it probably isn’t.

                                    Agreed and why I consider Docs to be my consultants or advisors, only I have say on what to do.

                                  • #91891
                                    Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                    Moderator

                                      edit – there is a difference between acute pain and chronic pain. #3 is specific to acute pain.

                                      Lol, I guess that addresses my “but” comment. ;-)

                                    • #91892
                                      wheelsee
                                      Participant

                                        edit – there is a difference between acute pain and chronic pain. #3 is specific to acute pain.

                                        Lol, I guess that addresses my “but” comment. ;-)

                                        Yep…..thanks for keeping me honest…..I forget sometimes. When I’m working with a patient, I know their specific history and tailor everything to them. When dealing with generalities, I sometimes forget to put in the qualifiers….

                                      • #91893
                                        Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                        Moderator

                                          I am glad we have so many here with real medical backgrounds. I consider my medical knowledge pretty extensive for a layman, it’s based on about 50% training and the rest on having suffered so may conditions.

                                        • #91894
                                          RobRoy
                                          Participant

                                            About physical therapists, I have no degenerative bone thing going on, but over the course of years I worked myself out into some serious back pain, and after being cleared of physical deformaties by the sawbones he sent me to PT and he got me on track.

                                            From barely able to tie my shoes to where I am now, it is good.

                                          • #91895
                                            wheelsee
                                            Participant

                                              For those who are looking at seeing a PT (Physical therapist) –

                                              1) each state defines scope of practice – anywhere from specific modalities being required to be on the prescription all the way to full, independent practice (no prescription required) and everything in between.

                                              2) IF your state requires a prescription from a DR/NP/PA, see if it can be really generic – specifically, “Evaluate & Treat” (eval & Tx). This gives PT the widest latitude in treatment. Many times they may pickup on a concurrent injury as they tease out the problem.

                                              3) IF you hear a PT ask “what specific treatment does your doc want?” – LEAVE….. I expect PT to KNOW how to treat specific conditions. EX: We repair your rotator cuff (RC) and we write for PT post-surgical. ALL the PTs we send to have very specific RC treatment regimens, they know HOW to treat patients without my input. I am NOT a PT and depend heavily on PT in getting our patients back up and running (engaging in life). Occasionally, I might ask them to back off a bit but this usually at the beginning and specifically due to the extent of the damage/repair.

                                              While the general public may say “my shoulder hurts,” it could be anything from musculoskeletal (rotator cuff injury, labral injury, strain, bicep tendon tear, etc) to referred pain (injury actually at the neck, the elbow, ribs, etc) to pneumonia, gallbladder, blood clot in the lungs, broken collarbone and on and on (including, but not limited too, etc, etc). This is directed at comment #2.

                                            • #91896
                                              wheelsee
                                              Participant

                                                Also – in GENERAL

                                                if you go to medicine doc (family practice, internal medicine, etc) – expect to have medicines be the primary discussions.

                                                If you go to a surgeon – expect to have surgery be the primary discussion.

                                                Neither is right, neither is wrong. Just differences in focus (the hint is in each name).

                                              • #91897
                                                Corvette
                                                Participant

                                                  I agree with most everything written in this thread. A good Chiropractor can help some problems. A good Physical Therapist ditto. I agree that a large percentage of MD’s (after they determine that there is no emergency) prescribe meds and more meds.

                                                  I am very open minded about the healing arts. Ever since the Navy Optometrist told me the the reason I was getting near sited was “because I was getting old” (age 23) I have been open to non traditional methods. Instead of giving me reading glasses (which lessened the stress on my eyes while looking at radar for 12 hours a day), he prescribed long distance glasses; which made the problem worse.

                                                  Here is a good example. The rotator cuff was giving me real grief in my left arm. It was constantly sore, with a dull pain. Kind of like carpel tunnel in the wrist. It was hard to move and I had problems raising my arm above a certain point.

                                                  The MD gave me steroids and talked about surgery as the next step. The Chiropractor worked on it to no resolution. A massage therapist would loosen it up and then it would come back.

                                                  Finally, I mentioned it to my wife’s natural healing friend and he recommended I see a certain Acupuncturist who had been trained in China. I walked in and explained the problem and he said: “oh, you have 50-year- old shoulder. How old are you?” I told him I had just turned 50. Three sessions later and the pain was gone and it has never returned.

                                                • #91898
                                                  A_A_Ron2guns
                                                  Participant

                                                    Don’t for get the essential oils :wacko:

                                                    Damn witch doctors. Go to a real sports medicine specialist. I’ve gone to chiropractors before and it’s a bandaid for real long term problems.

                                                  • #91899
                                                    Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                                    Moderator

                                                      Don’t beat around the bush, tell me what you really think! ;-)

                                                    • #91900
                                                      Roadkill
                                                      Participant

                                                        Is Whisky an essential oil?

                                                      • #91901
                                                        wheelsee
                                                        Participant

                                                          Re: why we do these crazy things when we know Surgery is indicated.

                                                          You’re seen for a RC tear which is confirmed on exam and by MRI (not the end-all, be-all that people think). Yet your doc talks about a steroid injection….many times our treatment plan is dictated by your insurance. We may KNOW that the steroid injection won’t heal it, but your insurance won’t approve surgery until you’ve had an injection…..welcome to who really dictates patient care (hint – it ain’t the docs)

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