Broadhead In The Leg

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    • #109559
      tango
      Participant

        This is for anyone going out to the back country for any reason, but especially hunting of any kind. This is why you carry med gear. Most of the time it’s boo-boos and accidents, but it can get really bad really easily and really fast.

        These guys are completely unprepared for this situation and they are “professional” hunters.

        For Medical commentary: @st4t3s @idahocajun @wheelsee @mdbjjc

      • #109560
        JohnnyMac
        Participant

          “…what are you supposed to do, tie it up above it or below it?”

          But at least they’re humble about it:
          “we’ll have to have a medical person critique us afterwards…”

        • #109561
          idahocajun
          Participant

            I love these kinds of videos, they generally make me feel better about life (also love FailArmy)! I think this definitely highlites a general mentality We all see very commonly. If you don’t have the mindset, haven’t trained, don’t have the equipment…when things go sideways you’ll be in this kind of situation.

            As for this wound…that dude was LUCKY! Through and through penetrating trauma to the lower leg in the meat that didn’t appear to hit any of the major vessels. In my opinion with this:
            1. Hemorrhage control! If bleeding actively from wound, tourniquet. Hell, I’d have that tourniquet in place ready to go the entire time…just in case.
            2. Check pulses and sensation (dorsalis pedis and posterior tibial) to make sure blood supply and neurological function distal to wound is not compromised.
            3. Unless you’re prepared to deal
            With the aftermath in the field…DON’T pull the arrow out. Cut it on both ends, wound dressings with it in place. Transport as is. Remove it in a controlled setting. I personally have pulled things out in the ER that look like nothing and turn into a shit show. You don’t want that in the field.
            4. Transport! Most people don’t think it can happen to them. Comms in the backcountry are limited. Several companies make emergency beacons, etc. You may never need it, but when you do…you get the point! This guy was in a big group…no one had a litter? It’s all about the mentality.

            Whole warrior concept! Mentality, equipment, training. I just don’t get why it’s so damn hard to convince people of this.

          • #109562
            Corvette
            Participant

              This guy was in a big group…no one had a litter?

              I really like the litter we had in our assault packs at CLC…

              The Ultralight Poleless Litter is an ultra-compact, multi-use casualty evacuation platform designed for medical operators or individual soldiers. The Ultralight allows the user to always have a means of moving a casualty without carrying bulky overweight equipment.

              Made in the USA.

              $36.80

              https://www.tacmedsolutions.com/Ultralight-Poleless-Litter

            • #109563
              Joe (G.W.N.S.)
              Moderator

                DON’T pull the arrow out.

                I personally have pulled things out in the ER that look like nothing and turn into a shit show.

                Quoted for emphasis!

                There are countless examples of the object being the only thing keeping things in check.

              • #109564
                wheelsee
                Participant

                  1. HAVE A PLAN!! I just finished a hunt in a state north of me and seemed to have offended some of my fellow hunters when I asked about medevacs. I plan the VAST majority of my travel within reach of air medical (habits set LONG ago). I also know the name and dispatch numbers of areas traveling. From what I can tell for Romney WV – HealthNet Aeromedical (dispatch 800-255-2146) based in Martinsburg (43 miles, so ~ 25-minute flight time). You do NOT have to know the closest one. By calling dispatch, they will get the closest available helo to you. HEMS (sorry Max) works on the same concept of FD/EMS and mutual aid. This is another reason to become a 1st Responder – my call goes something like – “I’m a paramedic / ER nurse (whatever applies) on the scene of a hunting accident requesting EMS and a helicopter if available (and applicable).” I’ve driven up on my share of street scenes (off-duty, out-of-locale) and requested air medical, even by calling my own program, 150 miles away but trusted my people to do their jobs….to hear a helo coming in ~ 15 minutes later

                  2. HAVE THE TRAINING! Training trumps equipment > 95% of the time (yes, I made that number up; hate to use absolutes).

                  3. Echoing IdahoCajun – LEAVE the IMPALED ALONE!! (unless blocking airway). Early 80s, Beaumont FD – made a run on a teen-aged male, new driver, slid off the road and hit a cyclone post fence row with the upper rail in place (no fencing yet). He slid down the upper rail ~ 150’……..with the upper rail having gone through the windshield and into the right neck……for ~ 150′. We cut the upper rail on either side of the patient and took him in. There was very little blood. We found out later, the pipe had cored his neck, taking out the carotid, IJ and EJ. When the pipe was removed, he obviously started bleeding out but the surgeon was able to control everything as he was prepared and didn’t remove the pipe until he was ready. Even then, we were told blood was everywhere – yes, the patient survived.

                  4. IF you’re going to pack a wound, PACK IT! And yes, your patient should be screaming (at least you know they’ve got an airway :good: ) . You don’t need the newest, fanciest clotting bandage. See here https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/j.1553-2712.2011.01036.x

                  5. Echoing First Sergeant, DO YOU CARRY A TQ??

                • #109565
                  Virgil Kane
                  Participant

                    I agree that training trumps equipment, but an Israeli or OLAES bandage would have been handy in that situation. They were making a mess with that flour sack. Most hunters go unprepared. “I’ll be safe” or they still feel 19yo and invincible.

                    “You don’t know what you don’t know” applies again.

                    I’ve given Israeli bandages and TQ’s to fellow hunters and Boy Scout leaders. One should always have both at hand, but especially when sharp tools and firearms are being used.

                  • #109566
                    Roadkill
                    Participant

                      As seemingly very professional hunters, they were very lax in something so important as a med kit or IFAKs all around. They were very calm and did the best with what they had. I’ll give them props for that. Had he nicked an artery the outcome may have been bleak.

                    • #109567
                      First Sergeant
                      Moderator

                        I am surprised this doesn’t happen more often.

                        These guys are professional hunters, who by their own admission, never thought about something like this happening. No IFAK worth a damn and no plan for an evac. If you watch all the way to the end of the video, they blew off the advice about a CAT, sticking with the SWAT-T which ain’t worth a damn. These guys need a med class badly.

                        They have all kinds of money tied up in a lot of different technology and gear but not invested in what is needed.

                        At least they were willing to admit it.

                        FILO
                        Signal Out, Can You Identify
                        Je ne regrette rien
                        In Orbe Terrum Non Visi

                      • #109568
                        Civilianresponder
                        Participant

                          Recommended Medical training? I’ve been to a couple but can’t seem to get anybody else to participate….. Gun guys just don’t seem interested.

                        • #109569
                          wheelsee
                          Participant

                            Recommended Medical training? I’ve been to a couple but can’t seem to get anybody else to participate….. Gun guys just don’t seem interested.

                            Most aren’t….if it don’t go bang, no interest……

                            Shouldn’t prevent you and yours from taking…..

                            Check with your local FD for classes (free or small donation), include CPR.
                            Stopthebleed.org provides free training for stopping massive bleeding.
                            Take first aid classes from your local school or community college.

                            Emergency Care Attendant (ECA) do all the didactic work but none of the clinicals as an EMT…..so 40-hrs versus 160 hrs…..

                            When the state EMS conference comes to DFW (every November), there are PLENTY of classes available……forget the technology classes, no need to understand cardiac monitor if ya don’t have access to a hospital system (think meds).

                            Talk with EMS and ED folks in your neighborhood and church…..express the interest to learn, and someone will teach you……its just how we think (not to mention I’d REALLY like for you to know how to do X if we’re gonna be doing things together…..again, its how we think)

                            Get involved in Scouts, 4-H, etc with the kids. Then have contests to see who can moulage who up the best….then dress it. (do this outside, and don’t use momma’s good sheets…..don’t ask :whistle: )

                          • #109570
                            Civilianresponder
                            Participant

                              I’m actually interested in some more advanced classes, short of becoming an EMT. I’ve taken classes from several companies. Dark Angel Medical, one run by an EMT, one called Code 3 Medical. I’d like classes that are mostly running scenarios to practice and work on my stress innoculation.

                            • #109571
                              wheelsee
                              Participant

                                I’m actually interested in some more advanced classes, short of becoming an EMT. I’ve taken classes from several companies. Dark Angel Medical, one run by an EMT, one called Code 3 Medical. I’d like classes that are mostly running scenarios to practice and work on my stress innoculation.

                                Join a local volunteer FD/EMS……..volunteer with American Red Cross…..Baptist Men’s Group (they do the national disasters)

                              • #109572
                                Civilianresponder
                                Participant

                                  I’ll check into that. Thank you. Looking forward to Texas 2019!

                                • #109573
                                  wheelsee
                                  Participant

                                    Looking forward to Texas 2019!

                                    :good: :good: :bye:

                                  • #109574
                                    Abacus
                                    Participant

                                      Bar none the most useful thing I have picked up from the military is how to do self aid and buddy care or combat life saver type stuff. Guns are cool, but learning how to not bleed to death is probably more important big picture wise.

                                    • #109575
                                      Andrew
                                      Participant

                                        Nothing to add, just want email notifications for any other replies. I’ll be working a 48 again starting Fri. Besides y’all are way above my AEMT status. :good:

                                      • #109576
                                        First Sergeant
                                        Moderator

                                          Recommended Medical training? I’ve been to a couple but can’t seem to get anybody else to participate….. Gun guys just don’t seem interested.

                                          That’s typical in the gun world. Nobody ever thinks that it can happen to them or that they will just magically know what to do.

                                          You will use your medical knowledge way more often than the gun skills. Both are equally important.

                                          FILO
                                          Signal Out, Can You Identify
                                          Je ne regrette rien
                                          In Orbe Terrum Non Visi

                                        • #109577
                                          Civilianresponder
                                          Participant

                                            Deployedmedicine.com is a great source of TCCC info. They have some informative videos and other stuff.

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