So you think you are ready to fight tyranny?

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  • This topic has 7 replies, 4 voices, and was last updated 2 months, 1 week ago by Anonymous. This post has been viewed 405 times
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    • #127480
      Joe (G.W.N.S.)
      Moderator

        I’ve been monitoring some talk coming out of Virginia since we know the date of its fall.

        It seems very likely Virginians will be on the receiving end of some of the most comprehensive gun control in the U.S. As soon as a month and half to two months!

        Can some miracle happen to prevent it?

        I don’t know!

        So you think you are ready to fight tyranny?

        Do you really know what that means?

        It’s obvious many won’t comply, even New York and Connecticut can’t get meaningful compliance.

        Are you going to hide or cache your then illegal contraband?

        Maybe some armed Civil Disobedience rallies?

        In other states that kind of thing was virtually ignored during event, then some of the low hanging fruit were picked of one at a time.

        You ready for the legal expenses if its you? Or are you going to go out in a blaze of glory?

        What about your family if you are not single?

        Can they financially survive without your income?

        Maybe you will go into hiding so they can’t find you?

        Do you have a provisioned hidey hole with no connections to you?

        Are you taking family with you?

        What do they think of that?

        Spouse onboard or have they just tolerated your quirks? Will spouse or children do the “see something, say something” you into a Looney bin? ;-)

        No? Are you sure?

        If they aren’t going with you, what are they going to do?

        Are they going to forsake you? Real or part of a deception?

        What will your spouse do it they threaten to take kids? It’s not unheard of to suggest some choice foster care for kids if spouse doesn’t play ball!

        Maybe you have some fantasy of working by day fighting by night?

        Is that realistic? No paper/electronic trail to put you away?

        Hasn’t really happened on a large scale anywhere yet, but if they come in the night for your contraband will they find everything? Have you thought of some caches in case things don’t follow your preconceptions?

        Will you resist with your family in house?

        If forewarned how quick can you leave your house?

        Seconds? Minutes? Longer?

        If you manage to leave just before a raid how much of your contraband/supplies will you lose?

        I am not even going to get into whether or not you have a team, but if you do are they truly going to show up?

        No I am not trying to talk you out of resisting tyranny, but I am hoping you have a realistic idea of what that may actually mean.

        Virginians don’t have much time left to prepare.

        If it’s not a hard decision your probably fooling yourself!

        …or maybe you really are ready!

        Note: I am not looking for anyone to publicaly answer these questions.

      • #127517
        Max
        Keymaster

          I’ll jump in. I’m out in public anyway, so the rest of you keep your thoughts to yourselves if there is any risk in typing them (i.e. from monitoring etc).

          This is absolutely the nub of it, what Joe has written.

          Everyone has their own personal decisions to make. We are mostly all raising families and trying to get by. I’m not going to list it all, but there are those hard decisions over acceptance versus what is important to you and the future for our children.

          But we are probably talking individuals here, because as far as I am aware no one got anywhere near having a real team or even battle buddy yet, for all the reasons we have gone over ad infinitum as to why guys can’t find team. So it is probably heads of households making the decision to do something, or not, against the backdrop of family in the house and the potential of a raid anytime at your house or while you drive or are at work.

          I have considered this a lot. What to do. You have to recall that there are a whole bunch of people out there who have not trained at MVT and are not on this forum. Some are less rational than others. So maybe those guys are kicking things off without much thought? Or does it go the way of all the other places where it is just meek acceptance and trying to get by with the new ‘laws’? And not to be too critical of the individuals who succumb (it may / likely will be us next), because after all they are just individuals, and if Virginia cannot summon it’s ‘Merica sufficiently to act against tyranny, what is an individual to do?

          The bottom line is that these ‘laws’ are intolerable and are EXACTLY what the 2A was designed to prevent. Yet they are going to legislate away the very weapons that are designed to prevent this. But ‘Merica has proved to be an easy victim to this.

          I have pondered long and hard what to do. I have considered armed civil disobedience. Armed protest is kind of stupid though, unless you have an actual tactical plan for if they try and bring the hammer down in whatever park you are hanging about in, ARs slung. It gets close to all that Malheur / Bundy Ranch thing where guys put themselves in a poor tactical box. Unless you had a sound tactical plan to go along with the guys stood in the park. But as Joe says, Tyranny plays the patient game and holds back, and then gets you later as you drive to work. So you basically just fucked your life. You put yourself on display for later collection.

          There is actual a logical follow-on to what I wrote above about the civil disobedience protest – if you are going to do it, you really want tyranny to act and protect yourself with self-defense right there and then. Because logically you put yourself on display and your time at large is limited after that. So, if you did it, you want it to kick off right there, which is potential for a bloodbath in a poor tactical situation (in a park or whatever).

          So then you simply don’t comply? What about training, shooting, purchasing more stuff and ammo from that point onwards? You are now a victim to any neighbor who wants to inform on you. Welcome to socialism.

          The real and true answer to this, the one that is lawful in terms of the Constitution and the ideal of America, is that this tyranny must be resisted. It cannot be allowed to happen. But what can individuals do? I know we just re-elected a pro-2a sheriff in Culpeper County. Our delegate that we elected (Freitas) is an ex-SF pro-2A guy. Does this make Culpeper County a gun-friendly zone? What can we do here? Can we have a 2A sanctuary?

          I just posted the latest from the VCDL (another thread). They plan on resisting this. When I say ‘resisting’ I do not mean a lone wolf with a gun getting himself killed. I may even volunteer / see if there is a space for being the liaison with the Sheriff here in Culpeper, if it is not already being done.

          I suggest we all volunteer to help these efforts to correct this short of violence. Let it play out. If it becomes tyranny, even perhaps with State LEO rubbing up against local Sheriff departments in an attempt to run confiscation, then we will be at the wall where everyone has to make a decision to actively resist or go gently into the night of socialism. Let us hope we do not have to go there.

        • #127521
          RobRoy
          Participant

            I see one advantage right off the bat for Virginia FreeFor, the clown show up in NOVA immediately took to acting like a conquering colonizing army. They are literally in their propaganda organs boasting about their being foreign to VA.

            Now of course these New Colonizers will use the effective political rhetoric of “sexist, racist and homophobic” and of course the conservatives will stooge and go into their usual step an fetch routine, BUT enough Americans are coming to the conclusion that people who utter “sexist, racist and homophobic” are in fact kind of evil.

            Insert 4GW political theory here. 4GW political theory is about legitimacy of the state (government and it’s strap hangers), not running about the woods with a rusty AK.

            My screed ties into Max’s BTW

            • This reply was modified 2 months, 1 week ago by RobRoy.
          • #127547
            Joe (G.W.N.S.)
            Moderator

              Note: I am not looking for anyone to publicaly answer these questions.

              …the rest of you keep your thoughts to yourselves if there is any risk in typing them (i.e. from monitoring etc).

              Just be careful.

              So now; if not before, you know some of the risks.

              So if this were to transition into active physical resistance.

              What would the Federal Government reaction be?

              Under Trump?

              Under one of the Looney Democrat candidates (though that’s pretty obvious since we will probably be shortly behind Virginia at that point)?

              How about citizens in the rest of the country?

              Would good people and loons flock to Virginia?

              How about the surrounding States?

              What are the odds of it spreading to other States?

            • #127548
              Joe (G.W.N.S.)
              Moderator

                Something easily overlooked is the propaganda war component to resistance!

                Additionally what is morally acceptable?

                A preemptive strike before tyranny sheds first blood would most likely be viewed in a negative light.

                The best option from my point of view maybe standoff between County and State Government spearheaded by County Sheriff. Legal arguments aside, this would add apparent legitimacy to any self defense action.

                I suspect the Virginia Air/National Guard couldn’t be counted on to act on behalf of Governor, but it maybe possible for Governor to cherry pick specific personnel so I wouldn’t completely dismiss the threat.

              • #127549
                Max
                Keymaster

                  So let’s just be clear, and philosophically get our ducks in a row. The 2A has already been infringed, but certainly before my time. However, the law of the land enshrines gun ownership. Any attempts to infringe are unlawful, and also clearly against the right and prerogative to self-defense.

                  Thus, any attempts to send armed men to take weapons is morally wrong and offensive. Make no mistake that unless you are using weapons for morally offensive (i.e. malum in se) reasons, you have the moral and legal high ground, whatever is passed in the State Legislature.

                  At that point, if sweeping gun control is passed (a law against the Constituion is NO LAW) then it is simply a practical, not moral, decision, on how to proceed.

                  Thus, what is worth you life? I am not saying that to deter you, but as a real question. You cannot be an individual, and you have a family who you must protect. Bringing armed men in the night does not perhaps protect them? So it really becomes a question of the political mood in Virginia, and if there is any traction to be had.

                  I am not giving you an action plan. I am simply being realistic and assessing the moral vs practical implications of any action.

                  We have a clear issue with tyranny in the US, and it just became very real in Virginia. This is being voted in by 1/2 the populace. See my article on Democracy and how to fix it! What happens next is extremely important and perhaps leads the way in which the country as a whole will proceed into the future.

                  Liberty or Tyranny?

                  The seal of Culpeper is, ironically, 2 minutemen with ‘Liberty or Death.’ How ironic on the wall when you go to pay taxes at the treasury!

                • #127554
                  Max
                  Keymaster

                    Also, show up to the Raging Inferno on 14th December and we can chat in meatspace.

                  • #127660
                    Anonymous
                    Inactive

                      Any form of resistance needs to focus on not appearing as the aggressor, the state has the advantage of legal legitimacy through their incumbency that any opposition movement lacks. The classical insurgent tactic here would be to place enough pressure on the state that they overreact and discredit themselves. I hate to sound pessimistic, but any revolution needs martyrs, if things get that bad. Our forebears had Crispus Attucks and the other victims of the Boston Massacre. The militia movement of the 1990s had the Branch Davidians and the Weavers. So far the closest in recent memory has been LaVoy Finicum, though the Bundy uprising was tied to regional concerns rather than a national-level cause. When I was overseas every local base had a “şehid room” where meetings were conducted, the walls were covered in posters of movement martyrs and images of the fallen, including some I knew personally. “If you’re not ready to die, take freedom out of your vocabulary.”

                      Of course I hope it doesn’t get that far because anyone who has seen this fuckery up close and personal should be scared near-shitless of the thought of it happening here, but we also can’t ignore the apparent trajectory of history. Check international news, we live in very turbulent times.

                      Obviously taking arms, even as protest, is always the means of last resort and you need to be able to justify it, which means you have exhausted all legitimate legal and political venues. If your own political base isn’t convinced, you lose and get executed by some half-drunk sergeant in a dilapidated schoolhouse, then they photograph and parade your corpse for all your friends to see.

                      The Constitution is a piece of paper that can be interpreted just like any other deified text, there as many interpretations of the Constitution as there are Christian denominations. Pro-Constitution messaging works for most of our in-groups but is meaningless towards out-groups.

                      There have been right-wing groups like the Oathkeepers threatening armed insurrection every time Trump faces a political crisis, it’s not constructive and makes the gun rights crowd look trigger-happy and inherently wedded to a single figurehead. Rather than walk around in all your gear ready to charge into the Third Battle of Manassas, better to leave one’s capabilities left to guesses. Unknowns scare adversaries more than knowns. “Power is not only what you have but what the enemy thinks you have.”

                      Discussing theoreticals beyond that in public and unencrypted channels is unsafe. I don’t want to write anything here I’d have to explain to JTTF, so…

                      Max, I saw you joking/half-joking about a fireside chat in person in another thread, if you were addressing me there I’d have to see what my schedule looks like in December, might be tied up elsewhere.

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