Partyzanski Sends: Review of "A Soldier's Load and Mobility of a Nation"

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  • This topic has 9 replies, 8 voices, and was last updated 1 year ago by RightBob. This post has been viewed 83 times
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    • #83327
      Max
      Keymaster

        Partyzanski sends:

        PZ reviews the classic, “A Soldier’s Load and Mobility of a Nation”.

        Applicable not just to military/militia, but backpackers, preppers planning to “bug out”, hunters and others.

        If you’ve watched any of the “Prepper” YouTube videos out there, you quickly realize most people don’t truly understand as PZ states, “there is discipline in the ounces” and have an unrealistic expectation of they can/should carry on extended forays.

        “The character who expects to be firing on all cylinders, day on day on is not just mistaken, but is dangerous to the well being of his fellows”

        “worn out men cannot think or fight”

        “to cut to the chase, the conclusion is that the load a man can carry in combat has not historically varied much for recorded history. That load is about 50 pounds. More than that, you become ineffective quickly”.

        http://tinyurl.com/ha62kxc

        http://stopshouting.blogspot.com/2016/05/shtf-self-education-series-from-library_10.html#more

      • #83328
        wildbill
        Participant

          Per Lind in On War he states that Marines (I would assume Army too) can average 10-15 kilometers a day but the German line infantry in WWII sustained 40 kilometers daily. So my question is, is it a PT problem or a load problem?

        • #83329
          Corvette
          Participant

            Per Lind in On War he states that Marines (I would assume Army too) can average 10-15 kilometers a day but the German line infantry in WWII sustained 40 kilometers daily. So my question is, is it a PT problem or a load problem?

            Its a self supporting circle.. Load… PT…Terrain..fuel (food) intake. One needs to be up to dealing with all and have the ability to sustain it realistically.. Or you’re combat ineffective.. Or Survivalist dead..

            Bergmann

          • #83330
            wildbill
            Participant

              Mechanized infantry seems to be a big factor too both in load and fitness but then again that is what keeps the military industrial complex rolling in the money.

            • #83331
              D Close
              Moderator

                MVT Rifleman standards of a 30# ruck and a 8-10# weapon come close to that 50lb number. Working on that PT piece is thus very important. If you aren’t meeting that standard, the capability of your group will be impacted. Medical readiness is another key factor. Get healthy, drop extra weight and you will make that goal much easier to reach.

              • #83332
                DiznNC
                Participant

                  It’s still as true today as it wuz back in the day. If you are not out there humping a ruck right now, come crunch time, you will not be able to hump a ruck effectively.

                  The standard in my day was 50 lbs all up (weapon and rucksack), 20 miles a day. In theory, you were expected to be able to keep doing this for consecutive days as required. In reality, you did this once a month (in line infantry units) and it kicked most everyone’s ass. It was brutal in full-blown tropical areas, such as the PI and Oki. Korea was more a bitch from the mountain terrain. Even stateside at Pendleton was tough in summer.

                  Each time and place has examples of what’s possible. Zulu warriors are documented running 50 miles with spear and shield and then engaging in battle. Patton’s 3d Armor marched for days in winter conditions to relieve Bastogne. The Paras and Bootnecks Tab across the Falklands.

                  Well-conditioned troops are capable of awesome achievements. You can too, if you work at it. These days I find it’s a trade off. I may not be as physically strong as before, but mentally I’m much stronger. It becomes as much a mental game after a few miles, as it is the physical.

                • #83333
                  RightBob
                  Participant

                    One approach that I have found helpful is to use lightweight backpacking principles to limit my sustainment load and make it as efficient as possible. That way you can allocate more weight to enhance your fighting ability without compromising your mobility.
                    I’ve used lightweight backpacking principles on hikes of the Appalachian Trail and Long Trail, and have gotten my pack with hiking gear down to about 11 pounds, not counting food and water. Sites like backpacking light and adventurealan are very helpful.

                  • #83334
                    tango
                    Participant

                      One approach that I have found helpful is to use lightweight backpacking principles to limit my sustainment load and make it as efficient as possible. That way you can allocate more weight to enhance your fighting ability without compromising your mobility.
                      I’ve used lightweight backpacking principles on hikes of the Appalachian Trail and Long Trail, and have gotten my pack with hiking gear down to about 11 pounds, not counting food and water. Sites like backpacking light and adventurealan are very helpful.

                      Light weight is the future of LBE. The balance of weight and durability is the challenge. In the same boat with you doing UL Backpacking as a hobby. A lot of the equipment is not a direct crossover due to colors and durability reasons but material technology and smart stitching are coming a long way VERY fast. Expect to see a wave of new light weight gear in the coming years. Cordura is heavy AF and soaks up a lot of water. There are a number of materials that are significantly lighter and durable enough.

                      The methods for paring down your gear and figuring out what you *actually* need do cross over 100%. It’s a great hobby to practice that skill and get some fun fitness work done, for sure. UL food options are also great videos to watch to learn how to pack food light, stop packing MREs and Mountain House, and learn how to resupply locally.

                      11 lb. Base Weight is pretty good @RightBob. That’s 2-3 seasons though, right?

                      Throw some pics from your next trip up in here:
                      https://forum.maxvelocitytactical.com/forums/topic/rucking-pics/

                    • #83335
                      Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                      Moderator

                        Cordura is heavy AF and soaks up a lot of water. There are a number of materials that are significantly lighter and durable enough.

                        ULTRAcomp is one example, I’ve been very pleased with its performance.

                      • #83336
                        RightBob
                        Participant

                          Tango – Yes, that’s my three season configuration right now. I’ve slept on the snow with my current gear just to know I can do it, but I would take more gear if I knew I was heading out into true winter conditions.
                          It’s interesting how much more information and gear is available now than when I started. There’s now much more of an established lightweight long distance culture, which makes it easier to benefit from the experience of others.

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