82nd Airborne Division’s Immediate Response Force arrives in D.C.

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    • #148216
      Joe (G.W.N.S.)
      Moderator

        82nd Airborne Division’s Immediate Response Force Headed to D.C. amid Riots

        Excerpt:

        The Pentagon has ordered the 82nd Airborne Division’s Immediate Response Force to deploy to the D.C.-area amid rioting across the nation, according to multiple sources on background.

      • #148220
        First Sergeant
        Moderator

          Insurrection Act wont be pretty.

          FILO
          Signal Out, Can You Identify
          Je ne regrette rien
          In Orbe Terrum Non Visi

        • #148232
          Thomas
          Participant

            Wasn’t meant to be. Examples have to be made.

          • #148235
            Spoon
            Participant

              Illegal

            • #148239
              Joe (G.W.N.S.)
              Moderator

                Illegal

                Positioning them to D.C. isn’t illegal, however he can’t use them without using authority granted under Insurrection Act.

                The act empowers the US president, at the request of a state government, to federalize the National Guard and to use the remainder of the Armed Forces:

                when requested by a state’s legislature or governor, to address an insurrection against the state (§251),

                to address an insurrection against the federal government (§252), or

                hinders the execution of the laws such that citizens are deprived of constitutional rights.

                Summarising: insurrection against State, Nation, or People.

                Infrequently thought of example: Virginia Gov Northam moves to disarm Virginia people, Insurrection Act could be used to intervene action that deprives citizens constitutional rights.

              • #148240
                JohnnyMac
                Participant

                  I know it’s been used before, but it sets up the potential for a Boston Massacre.

                  More disturbing is that it sets a modern precedence. Elected socialists in the future will feel more comfortable using Army to enforce their edicts.

                  This is a macrolevel issue, but it feels like bad juju

                • #148241
                  Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                  Moderator

                    More disturbing is that it sets a modern precedence.

                    It’s been used at least twice in my lifetime.

                    Elected socialists in the future will feel more comfortable using Army to enforce their edicts.

                    This will happen when Socialists gain power regardless of whether it’s used now or not.

                  • #148244
                    Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                    Moderator

                      It’s been used at least twice in my lifetime.

                      Correction: It’s been used Seven times in my lifetime.

                    • #148247
                      JohnnyMac
                      Participant

                        This will happen when Socialists gain power regardless of whether it’s used now or not.

                        That’s entirely possible. When I used the word modern, I really meant post 9/11. Correct me if I’m wrongg, but the last time it was used is 1992? A lot has changed since then.

                      • #148248
                        Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                        Moderator

                          Correct me if I’m wrongg, but the last time it was used is 1992?

                          Correct.

                          Remember I am not necessarily endorsing use of the Insurrection Act, however it is there for a reason.

                          How long do you allow cities to burn?

                          Protests are perfectly acceptable, however rioting and looting?

                          This video I posted from Jacksonville…

                          …if these tactics were used against peaceful protesters I would be pissed. Against rioters I have no problem with it.

                          At what point do we stop ignoring the threat groups such as Antifa pose?

                          Particularly the power brokers behind them?

                          If Local and State governments were stopping this violence we wouldn’t even have the discusion.

                          Due to incompetence and/or complicity some Local and State governments are supporting this violence.

                          The Insurrection Act should not be used lightly, but it does have legitimate use as well.

                          During the Rose garden speech did you note Trumps mention of the 2nd Amendment?

                          Infrequently thought of example: Virginia Gov Northam moves to disarm Virginia people, Insurrection Act could be used to intervene action that deprives citizens constitutional rights.

                          Is this hypothetical that far fetched? :unsure:

                          What if a direct link could be established that Northam was working with Antifa or similar elements to usurp the Constitution?

                          Just brainstorming. ;-)

                        • #148249
                          wheelsee
                          Participant

                            Correct me if I’m wrongg, but the last time it was used is 1992? A lot has changed since then.

                            Last used in 1992 for the LA riots. So its a mixed bag. While there is precedence for using it during riots, the question is the political climate today.

                          • #148250
                            Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                            Moderator

                              …the question is the political climate today.

                              Another thought/question, would you rather fight a Socialist Insurgency with the Government or be part of a Insurgency fighting a Socialist Government? ;-)

                            • #148252
                              JohnnyMac
                              Participant

                                I’m pretty sure we’re all in agreement that rioting and looting are wrong and should be stopped.

                                Is the local/state government really incapable of stopping it? What will the 82nd do that NG and police can’t?

                              • #148253
                                wheelsee
                                Participant

                                  Is the local/state government really incapable of stopping it? What will the 82nd do that NG and police can’t?

                                  Political will??

                                • #148254
                                  Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                  Moderator

                                    What will the 82nd do that NG and police can’t?

                                    The National Guard is capable of relieving the pressure so LEA’s can enforce the Law, this is not in question. IMHO

                                    The 82nd IRF is not accountable to State and Local governments.

                                    So if State and Local governments are unwilling to enforce law (for whatever reason) the 82nd is willing.

                                    However as First Sergeant has mentioned, the 82nd will not be gentle about it.

                                    Note this isn’t specific to the 82nd, but any military combat force.

                                  • #148255
                                    Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                    Moderator

                                      Political will??

                                      :good:

                                    • #148263
                                      wheelsee
                                      Participant

                                        What will the 82nd do that NG and police can’t?

                                        Think Katrina. There were problems using State Police (LA) and local NG. Those NG members still have to see SP at the store and go to church with. Once LTG Honore (famous for telling media “don’t get stuck on stupid”) arrived and outside NG forces used (Arkansas IIRC), things started changing. I have specific knowledge of SP getting into a pissing contest with AR NG at a check-point. AR NG exerted their authority (quite bluntly I might add) with their “viewpoint” being immediately complied with.

                                        Think also Tiananmen Square (as an extreme). The local authorities sided with the protestors and stayed at a stand-still until outside units came in.

                                      • #148264
                                        Spoon
                                        Participant

                                          Thanks for the readjustment Joe.

                                          DoD presence would certainly be heavy-handed. What would ROE look like. It can’t look like their typical rule book.

                                        • #148265
                                          Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                          Moderator

                                            What would ROE look like?

                                            Typically they retain the right of self defense, ability to defend others, ability to temporarily detain suspects until turned over to Civilian LEO’s.

                                            Generally minimum force needed to accomplish assigned mission.

                                            Depending on Unit involved, you do not want to physically resist or take action against such Units unless prepared for consequences.

                                            Additionally as Wheelsee noted if LEO’s attempt to interfere with Unit mission they will have no reluctance to detain said LEO’s!

                                          • #148267
                                            Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                            Moderator

                                              If this actually happens; not just positioned, this may incite the Socialists to a point that makes “Trump derangement syndrome” pale in comparison.

                                              However unlikely, I see possibilities here.

                                              If the Socialists lose control and escalate their Coup against America then a opportunity exists to put a end to this Socialist insurrection before they can obtain the Federal power in its entirety.

                                              Unlikely?

                                              Probably, but what if it’s not? ;-)

                                            • #148297
                                              Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                              Moderator

                                                82nd Airborne Division Arrives to DC Metro Area with Black Hawks and Chinooks

                                                Excerpt:

                                                An 82nd Airborne Division’s Immediate Response Force battalion arrived to Andrews Air Force Base in Maryland Monday evening for a civil unrest mission in the nation’s capitol, according to sources.

                                                The IRF battalion — which deployed to Iraq earlier this year to quell Iran-backed violence — brought approximately 750 soldiers, ten Black Hawk helicopters, and four Chinooks, according to sources. The helicopters are utility, not attack, and are used to transport troops short distances.

                                                The aircraft are just one of the ways troops could be transported, but would give the IRF the ability to rapidly deploy to a number of locations in the D.C. Metro area quickly.

                                                The force was ordered to the region on Monday afternoon, after being told to be ready on Saturday, sources told Breitbart News.

                                                Two more IRF battalions have been put on short-notice alert status — meaning they would have to be ready to deploy within two hours if ordered.

                                                The orders to the IRF and other active-duty military units come as President Trump urged state governors to take back the streets from rioters, who have engaged in a spree of violence, looting, destruction of property, and other crimes.

                                                Washington, D.C., stayed relatively quiet on Monday night compared to previous nights after the deployments were ordered.

                                                Trump also fully-activated the D.C. National Guard on Sunday, to respond to the mass unrest in Washington. Rioters burned buildings, including a historic church just one block away from the White House, injured Secret Service officers, and engaged in looting and violence.

                                                Violence has engulfed what began as more peaceful protests last week, over the death of George Floyd after a Minneapolis police officer knelt on his neck.

                                                Trump said in a press conference on Monday that he was on the side of peaceful protestors, but warned rioters to go home.

                                              • #148298
                                                Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                                Moderator

                                                • #148312
                                                  First Sergeant
                                                  Moderator

                                                    The Insurrection Act is an absolutely last resort. As I stated, it wont be pretty. And as @Thomas said, it’s not meant to be.

                                                    Don’t think those guys are chomping at the bit to crack skulls. They don’t want to do it.

                                                    When it’s gotten to the point that mayor’s, governor’s, state AG’s and local police can’t or won’t restore order, what’s left? The security of the American people is one of the President’s duties.

                                                    None of them are going to let you do it.

                                                    FILO
                                                    Signal Out, Can You Identify
                                                    Je ne regrette rien
                                                    In Orbe Terrum Non Visi

                                                  • #148407
                                                    wildbill
                                                    Participant

                                                      Unfortunately I think this is just a dress rehearsal for the November elections and then we will see the use of force escalate on both sides.

                                                    • #148428
                                                      First Sergeant
                                                      Moderator

                                                        This company commander and the PSG next to him need to be relieved and face a court martial.

                                                        FILO
                                                        Signal Out, Can You Identify
                                                        Je ne regrette rien
                                                        In Orbe Terrum Non Visi

                                                      • #148432
                                                        Joe (G.W.N.S.)
                                                        Moderator

                                                          Don’t disagree, but these guys need direction on how to handle such situations as well.

                                                          Such a basic response as we are here to protect you from violence as much as any other task.I

                                                          As but one example.

                                                        • #148438
                                                          veritas556
                                                          Participant

                                                            Kneel before Zod!

                                                          • #148440
                                                            veritas556
                                                            Participant

                                                              You have 153 days.

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